I'm not sure but I think this is probably the worst advice you could give someone. IMO

MoSun

Read this. www.contitevesna.com/pdfs/Toyota_ESC_Study.pdf

 

im just saying for use off the street i wouldnt drive around w/ it off

 

I have a Camaro Z28 with 320 hp at the rear wheels. It has a button on the dashboard that controls wheel spin. Traction control it's called. Driving this car is very safe normal day to day driving but, if I turn off traction control it's as wild a ride as anything you can imagine. It's a very unsafe car with it turned off. I assume the FJ would be the same way and since you've already LIT UP THE TIRES ON THE STREET I also assume you will be doing it again after YOUR bypasss switch is installed. I hope you understand I only protest because of the safety risks involved in bypassing VSC and that you posted about how to do it so others can try it for themselves. Bad very very bad practice on or off road. IMHO

MoSun

 

Why it be unsafe I had no cars with VSC until I bought my FJ. Just gives you more freedom of having an open differential. I noticed the new FJs have a cutoff switch installed from the factory its a nice option especially on the highway on ramp. The only problem with this mod is the fact the engine has to be recycled to turn it back on which might suck if it started to rain. Just pretend you are driving a slightly older car with no traction control.

 

If history serves as a guide, this thread has the potential to get very heated. I'm just reminding all participants to keep it civil, and if you feel the need to attack something, attack arguments, NOT the person making the argument.

OK? OK.

 

for sure, im not recomending doing it but for those who have been looking for a way this works. then again i only tested it for 10 min so i say do it at you own risk b/c i have no idea of long term affects on the vehicle or even voiding warranty

 

If history serves as a guide, this thread has the potential to get very heated. I'm just reminding all participants to keep it civil, and if you feel the need to attack something, attack arguments, NOT the person making the argument.

OK? OK.

I agree, just because you have a gun doesn't mean you should use it, same goes for information that could prove harmful if not used properly.

 

Good advice for offroad. Sometimes you go through something like a little bit of sand where you don't need 4 wheel drive but VSC gets you stuck and you have to use 4 wheel drive. It's not that dangerous. Toyotas are the only vehicles I've ever owned that had this. Never had a safety issue with any other vehicle without it.

 

Thanks JLam, I'm outa this post.

 

Sweet! Bring the update when you do the switch.

As far as the safety thing goes, I grew up in Minnesota (yea...we had some snow) and I drove cars, trucks, whatever that didn't have traction control or ABS for that matter and did just fine. Yeah sure there was some times that I sure could've used it, but oh well. But going around doing doughnuts and driving sideways (are all drift racers from snowy places?) in the snow was a very fond memory and I haven't out grown it yet.

So the next time it snows here (yeah right), I'm going to go over to the mini mall that I own, disconnect the traction control (by popping the hood or using the switch if I have one by then), and rip off some sweet doughnuts and laugh my arse off.

Just give us smart people the choice of whether or not to have such features engaged or not. I'm sick of people (or machines) thinking for me all the time. It's just a switch that to me is no different than the A-TRAC and you don't hear people saying that you can't do without it, not even Toyota.

 

I'll keep mine connected

 

If history serves as a guide, this thread has the potential to get very heated. I'm just reminding all participants to keep it civil, and if you feel the need to attack something, attack arguments, NOT the person making the argument.

OK? OK.

Holy crap...a pre-emptive spanking!

 

Sweet! Bring the update when you do the switch.

As far as the safety thing goes, I grew up in Minnesota (yea...we had some snow) and I drove cars, trucks, whatever that didn't have traction control or ABS for that matter and did just fine. Yeah sure there was some times that I sure could've used it, but oh well. But going around doing doughnuts and driving sideways (are all drift racers from snowy places?) in the snow was a very fond memory and I haven't out grown it yet.

So the next time it snows here (yeah right), I'm going to go over to the mini mall that I own, disconnect the traction control (by popping the hood or using the switch if I have one by then), and rip off some sweet doughnuts and laugh my arse off.

Just give us smart people the choice of whether or not to have such features engaged or not. I'm sick of people (or machines) thinking for me all the time. It's just a switch that to me is no different than the A-TRAC and you don't hear people saying that you can't do without it, not even Toyota.

AMEN!!

 

btw the parking break light stays on when disconnected and i think the ABS is off!!!!

 

Holy crap...a pre-emptive spanking!

Next I'm going to ban someone before they even sign up!

 

Why do we constanty search out ways to kill ourselves, or others?

 

Because WE want to!:fight:

 

Oh my gosh what did the world do when there was no ABS or VSC...

Nice post I was looking for a way to do this!!!!

Thanks for the info

MACTIKI

 

yeah this is my first car w/ ABS or VSC. i dont like the fact that a computeris controlling MY car, but im gonna keep in on when on the road

 

my lexus has a button to turn the VSC off if you dont want it. I wonder why they didn't put this feature on the FJ?

 

I have a Camaro Z28 with 320 hp at the rear wheels. It has a button on the dashboard that controls wheel spin. Traction control it's called. Driving this car is very safe normal day to day driving but, if I turn off traction control it's as wild a ride as anything you can imagine. It's a very unsafe car with it turned off. I assume the FJ would be the same way and since you've already LIT UP THE TIRES ON THE STREET I also assume you will be doing it again after YOUR bypasss switch is installed. I hope you understand I only protest because of the safety risks involved in bypassing VSC and that you posted about how to do it so others can try it for themselves. Bad very very bad practice on or off road. IMHO

MoSun

OK Big Brother, please don't think I'm bashing anyone, but I'm going to disagree with MoSun and agree w/ a few others so far. Personally, I think we are developing safer & safer vehicles at the expense of good 'ol driving skills. A Z28 w/ 320HP is by no means a crazy car to drive w/o traction control, as long as you have driven cars w/o computers telling you how to drive. I'm amazed how many people I talk to today that have NEVER driven a car w/o power brakes or power steering (let alone ABS or traction control systems). If you never experience driving w/o all these power & computer systems, you really don't know the limits of a car. I think people should drive a non-power brake car at least for a few days so they really know how much work goes into stopping a car when you jam on the brakes. Personally, I get a TON of satisfaction with jamming on the breaks of a classic car w/ no pwr brakes or ABS and stop w/o skidding. That comes with practice, something ABS can't teach you. By learning how to control cars at their limits teaches people how to really drive. Nowadays there are so many pathetic drivers on the roads it's scary.

It pains me to say it, but I really think in general Europeans are better drivers. In general they have less computer systems on the cars they offer the masses, yet improve things like brakes (many US models have to upgrade their brake packages before selling in Europe). Why? IMO America makes cars to get the idiots out of trouble, while the Europeans make cars that handle better in the hands of a skilled driver. Europeans drive on tighter roads & at greater speeds and guess what, they get out of the way of each other by using their mirrors & only driving in the left lane to pass...something that the US really needs to do better.

Therefore, I applaud ideas like letting me disable the VSC on my FJ since I know I can handle the FJ without it. Will I turn it off all the time? Obviously not. But please don't think that the minute you disconnect the VSC all hell is going to break loose on this vehicle. Even if you eliminated all computers onboard the FJ, it's still a million times more refined & safe to drive than any 80's Jeep, yet somehow people weren't killing themselves at alarming rates back then. Why? Because in general, the public had better driving skills than nowadays (IMO).

 

Personally, I think we are developing safer & safer vehicles at the expense of good 'ol driving skills.

I second that big time.

Don't get me wrong I like having all the tech mainly because I am a techy and I like to see what I can do with it but I get the feeling of too many people relying on the vehicle and not their skills.

On the another note even with all the fancy computerized "help your wheels stick to the pavement" stuff I still fishtailed from one side of the road to the other in the FJ last weekend in Montana, and I had a trailer with a snowmobile on it.

Full recovery with driving skills, steer/counter steer since the abs/vsc didn't have anything but wet ice to grab on. Traction control only works if you have something to get traction on.

 

Can I get an Amen brotha!

 

I have owned a BMW M5, 2 BMW M3, and a Mercedes E55 all of which had some kind of traction control system, and all of them had a button to disable it. I have never wrecked any of them when it is disabled and my E55 has 520 lbs torque, and 470 hp.

 

VERY well said Moby. Traction control is a great invention, especially with the majority of drivers on our roads being unskilled, but if you know how to handle an automobile you should be able to choose to turn that off. All cars with traction control systems should have an override, and many do. The ones that have switches typically work like this: traction control is on by default every time you start the car, if you want it off you have to hit the off switch every time you start the car. Good compromise between watching out for you and letting you have control when you want it. And given the FJ's power/weight, it wouldn't even resemble uncontrollable without the save-me-from-myself controls.

Good job san ant, keep up the pioneering. Just don't go cloning any sheep ok?

 

If the vehicle became so unsafe to drive without VSC, you'd think Toyota would kill the engine if those wires became disconnected.

This guy I work with just bought a Dodge Charger SRT8. It has some kind of traction control that you can't turn off witout a mod chip. I think the reason there is no switch to turn it off is that the manufacturers are scared of being held liable for providing a way to drive it with safety features disabled. Its the same reason that there are nag beeps for seat belts and no way to disable a driver's side airbag. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for seat belts and airbags, but unfortunately as-far-as VSC is concerned, it limits our ability to do donuts. It's just another place where our litigious society is sucking the fun out of life and defeating common sense and reason.

Edit: VSC not VCS (Veritas Cluster Server, got work on my brain)

 

Listen to that Old Fart Moby - sounds like he's been driving since the first Model T rolled off the assembly line!

But I know the truth - he is a young snapper head with an inferior liberal arts education!

But I will grant him that this time, for once , he speaks the truth a bit.

The idea is not to turn the VSC off to drive to the grocery store, the idea is to turn in off when you are wheeling in conditions where it would actually provide more control and performance if you could get it to slide around a bit (loose sand anyone?) if you have experience driving like that. And of course where are you going to get that experience if you have only driven vehicles with these electronic brain safety measures.

I won't turn off the VSC to defeat safety, but I would love to have this option for when it is appropriate to the driving conditions.

Heck, even the 2007 Jeep Rubicon has three settings for their version of this - Full On, Full Off, and Partial On and we can't give Jeep owners something to try and hang over our heads!

It's all good - in moderation.

 

I got to play with a 4-runner that had VSC on it a few years ago.. Found a nice muddy hill, and went to go climb it.. it only took a short distance before the VSC completly stopped and stuck the vehical, it wouldn't let it do anything in the slick mud. The 4-runner had a button to turn off the VSC.. I hit it, spun the tires (oh no!!!), and climbed the rest of the way right up that muddy hill.

Turning off VSC has nothing at all to do with a safty issue, it's a driver issue. If you can't correctly handle a vehical without VSC you maybe need to go learn to drive somemore... And what the heck did all of you drive before VSC was around? It's an idoit system, designed to kick in and take over for idiots. Just like ABS. Take a driver that knows what they are doing and you can control the vehical better than the VSC. Read the FJ manual. Toyota even warns that the ABS system takes more distance to stop the vehical. A good driver without ABS can stop one much quicker and in a shorter distance.. Both systems allow you to be a lazy driver. If you are relying on VSC or ABS for anything to save your butt, you need to exam how safe you are driving and your skills to begin with. What are you going to do in a real emergency? Just grab your butts and hope the systems save it for you?

Ok, end of my rant for the day..:spineyes: