Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum
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#1 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 08:54 AM
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Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

This is my first post... I first want to thank all. I have done so much reading here and gained much knowledge. I have an '07 4Runner and frequent T4R.org and T120. There are so many similarities between the FJC and the V6 T4R.

I chose to share this as I have learned much about filters here and many seem very interested in long-interval, larger filters here. This is pretty much a copy/paste from my other posts. I hope someone finds it "at least interesting". I saw this thread about larger filters but didn't want to hijack it. I think this heads in slightly different direction...

PS- anybody get good money from a 4Runner guy for your OE shocks/springs? That was probably my fault. I was one of the first to make use of your OE springs on a 4Runner.


I have decided to do some oil filter research. My goal was to come up with some larger filter options that would allow for a slight increased oil capacity AND take advantage of the 1GRFE’s filter position (right behind the fan stream). A larger exterior surface would, IMHO allow for slightly more heat transfer. I think the benefit of a larger filter on our application would be cooler oil, more filtration media (long-interval, synthetic guys will like that) and slightly more oil capacity.

The quick, knee-jerk reaction would be to spin-on a PL30001, PH8A, Toyota 15600-41010 or 90915-TD004 (big LC filter), Napa 1515 or similar. If you didn’t want to go that big maybe a PH3600 or PL20195… Easy enough and done, right? Well not so fast. A few quick reads (primarily at the FJC forums, those guys are so adventurous) revealed that due to our super-sweet oil filter location the filters seem to drain out. They seem to drain out overnight or longer and there was talk delays with the oil pressure rising and some noise. Based on other engine experience I don’t doubt that is a real possibility/likelihood. Next, the focus would then seem to be quality of the anti-drainback valve. I don’t doubt that the anti-drainback valve is important but I wasn’t willing to leave it there… On a long sit some oil can drainback through the center (return-side), IMHO and that's where the 'big' filters fail; less than perfect anti-drainback valves and some return through the center. IMHO the smaller volume of the stock sized filter means that if it does drain it refills quickly.

Last edited by CJ3Flyr; 07-01-2010 at 09:30 AM.
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#2 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 08:54 AM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

The next thing that entered into my mind was Frenchie’s blown engine due, in part (we think) to an Amsoil EOA57 filter. In researching and postulating over his trials and tribulations I concluded the following: 1) Yes, the obvious, why try to go that long on a filter, blah, blah, blah. In his defense he was following a non-traditional but reliably sourced alternative program. 2) If the bypass pressure of the EAO57 was lower he might not have blown the engine. Would he have had good filtration and adequate protection? Unlikely, he needed more media (bigger filter).

If I got it right Hastings and Amsoil filters are closely related. The EAO57 is probably the Hastings LF494 (which is unfortunate). It has a 20psi and is the filter Hastings thinks LF494 replaces the OE 90915-20004 and –YZZD3. The EAO57 is the filter that had issues that caused Amsoil to issue a TSB… By Hastings own catalog when you look up a 1GRFE filter it lists a LF589 which has an 14psi bypass, not a 20psi. Maybe the whole fiasco is a GIGO issue, maybe the 14psi is the correct number. Maybe, if the Toyota OE filters really bypasses at 20psi, Toyota needs to revisit that in light of oils getting thinner and the TSB authorizing 5w-20 in many of our 1GRFE’s. Either way something has been lost in translation.

I decided I wanted a bigger filter that would have the following attributes:
a) 1st class, reliable name brand.
b) Larger, taller etc.
c) A bypass lower than 20psi. (Most of the 1GRFE filters I looked at had a bypass rating of between 8 & 17psi. I’d like to be on the lower-end of that but that’s my choice.) With lots of media there’s no reason to have a high bypass pressure and it’s very unlikely you’d ever need to bypass.
d) No “dry starts” or delays in building oil pressure.

Last edited by CJ3Flyr; 07-01-2010 at 08:59 AM.
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#3 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 08:55 AM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

In studying different filters I came across an interesting feature on some filters that go on Perkins motors, a standpipe. The standpipe extends more than halfway into the filter. A standpipe in conjunction with an anti-drainback would/should prevent any drainback beyond what could occur with the OE-sized filter (which doesn’t have a standpipe).













The blue line shows the approximate depth of the standpipes...


I am currently running the Napa 1460. (I just screwed the BT215 on for the photo, I haven't run it yet.) My initial report is good, no dry starts, the filter feels and looks like a very high quality unit. Next up will be the BT215. Both of these filters are smaller in diameter than the PL30001 but DO incorporate a standpipe in addition to the anti-drainback valve. In all fairness, the few who use the K&N and the PL20195 report no issues too. So why do this? I am looking for a big filter that will never require more to fill up than an OE filter (after initial fill of course).

Next up will be the PL30001 sized BT216 and Napa 1806. I think I will end up running the 1806 if this goes well... If anyone else wants to jump in and report back… hint, hint:-)


Hope this is of interest, more later…

Last edited by CJ3Flyr; 07-02-2010 at 07:28 AM.
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#4 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 09:12 AM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

Sorry, I got lost somewhere. Why do you want a huge filter? I mean obviously for filteration. But, I've been running Toyota OEM filter for 70k miles now... I have never had any issues.

but, curious on more info... what kind of evaluations are going to do when done with each filter? Take apart the filter, Oil analysis, etc?

2007 FJ 6MT black -n- black
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#5 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 09:40 AM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

After I am happy with the start-up performance I may begin a regimen of longer-interval synthetic oil changes.

I have no doubt that the OE filter (or good aftermarket) is fine for normal intervals.

As far as 'analysis' is concerned; I will do it that when I begin my long interval regimen. As far as basic filter performance goes there's far smarter, motivated, fanatical individuals at the BITOG site. I'm not that into it. I used BITOG to determine that Wix/Napa and Baldwin/Hastings are generally fine quality filters. (I'm not saying they're the "best ever".)

I'm looking for a good filter option for long intervals (larger media) with no dry starts and if I can pick up a little oil capacity and a degree less oil temp then great.

Last edited by CJ3Flyr; 07-01-2010 at 09:48 PM.
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#6 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 10:27 AM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

gotchya... Have you thought of the amsoil bypass system: amsoil bypass filter install

or....... Why don't you get a relocation kit and run the biggest filter you can... if that's your goal.

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#7 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 10:41 AM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

Quote:
VT_RainMan previously said: View Post
gotchya... Have you thought of the amsoil bypass system: amsoil bypass filter install

or....... Why don't you get a relocation kit and run the biggest filter you can... if that's your goal.
My goal isn't "biggest possible" just big enough that I have confidence with a 10k interval. I also like to keep it simple.

A relocation kit has it's time and place, no doubt. I have used them in the past with great success.

The V6, as is, has the filter so ideally located I prefer to not add the complexity and potential failure associated with extra parts. Good suggestion though, thanks.

Last edited by CJ3Flyr; 07-01-2010 at 10:46 AM.
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#8 (permalink) Old 07-01-2010, 10:43 AM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

Quote:
CJ3Flyr previously said: View Post
My goal isn't "biggest possible" just big enough that I have confidence with a 10k interval. I also like to keep it simple. A relocation kit has it's time and place, no doubt. The V6, as is, has the filter so ideally located I prefer to not add the complexity and potential failure associated with extra parts.
I hear ya... i'm all about KiSS.

I think some people here are using amsoil, wix, or mann filtes for upwards of 10k miles with good results.

Couple oil gurus will surely chime in.

2007 FJ 6MT black -n- black
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#9 (permalink) Old 07-02-2010, 03:50 PM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

My experiences.......

I've been using the large Amsoil EaO15 Oil Filter(Fram Ph8a equivalent). It contains ~0.6 qts. more oil than the standard sized filter. I am using a 0W40 synthetic oil to speed up oil pump-up on cold starts.

The engine makes no noises on startup whether it's 100+F or -20F but the oil light does stay on 3-4 seconds longer in really cold weather, 2-3 seconds longer on cold starts on hot days. On hot restarts the oil light goes out immediately.

I like using the Amsoil EaO Oil filters because of their fine filtering capability, and I like the larger filters because of the additional filtering media and added oil capacity.

I don't like the extra time it takes for the oil light to go out.

I run my oil and filters for 10K miles.

I was considering going back to the EaO57 (stock sized Amsoil filter) since I change it out at 10K but they've discontinued it unfortunately since it can't hold up to their 25K mile claim. It was still a very good filter but not for that many miles IMO. At 10K intervals it would work just fine (for me).

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#10 (permalink) Old 07-02-2010, 06:51 PM
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Re: Larger oil filter for 1GR-FE

The simplest solution here is to change the filter at more frequent intervals...a pretty simple task considering the location on the FJ...

When the vehicle is cold, as in the morning before the first start, spinning off the filter, and replacing it, is mess-free and takes all of 5 minutes....IMO a much preferred solution than risking a prolonged dry start-up time, short as it might be. Remember, Toyota didn't accidentally pick that filter size...

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