I disagree (respectfully of course, not trying to argue), the chances that his becomes a highly publicized product quality issue is low. Far larger issues with other vehicles have gone largely unnoticed by the industry. Besides, since when is your dealer/car lot/average buyer ever that informed?
If it does become a large issue, then I see your point, but until then it is just another instance of speculation and would not hold water as a depreciated value claim.
As far as the welds, most are spot welds and it is highly dependent on the skill of the shop doing the work. I have not seen a Fender Apron replacement job done yet, so I will reserve any further comment on whether it is detectable by most (emphasize "most") until those photos are posted.
Yeah, we'll just have to see what happens. It does lack the jazz needed for a national story in mainstream press, no question. But the community of people with strong interest in this truck are a little better informed than the average, I would think, and then there's the Internet.
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Black Cherry
+Goodies
Stock for now
Toyota has how many decades of automotive design experience, including 4x4? Their designers and engineers have to be among the best in the world. It is nearly inconceivable to me that they don't know what is going on here. At a minimum, they have to have a pretty good idea.
In my judgment, the problem is that the FIX will require a significant redesign of components and Toyota simply isn't sure of how to proceed. More to the point, they don't know what to do with the early production models. Replace parts and hope that works? Initiate a buy-back program of some type, pro-rated to mileage?
I simply can't believe that they are clueless as to the cause, and fix. Even without examining affected parts, their engineers have to know the stresses and conditions that would cause these issues.
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Compared to what? At what cost? What hard evidence do you have? -Thomas Sowell
Toyota has how many decades of automotive design experience, including 4x4? Their designers and engineers have to be among the best in the world. It is nearly inconceivable to me that they don't know what is going on here. At a minimum, they have to have a pretty good idea.
In my judgment, the problem is that the FIX will require a significant redesign of components and Toyota simply isn't sure of how to proceed. More to the point, they don't know what to do with the early production models. Replace parts and hope that works? Initiate a buy-back program of some type, pro-rated to mileage?
I simply can't believe that they are clueless as to the cause, and fix. Even without examining affected parts, their engineers have to know the stresses and conditions that would cause these issues.
I agree with you here.
I'm sure the engineers have a good understanding of what is going on and what needs to be done to fix it. However when you get PR and/or bean counters involved you get yourself one sticky situation.
There is always a battle between engineering/design and finance/marketing.
I'm sure the engineers have a good understanding of what is going on and what needs to be done to fix it. However when you get PR and/or bean counters involved you get yourself one sticky situation.
There is always a battle between engineering/design and finance/marketing.
And then there's doing the right thing. I hope Toyota realizes that the way this is handled will influence future purchases for the folks involved. I know, it's not a significant amount of revenue if you look at the "big picture" for Toyota. But, I don't give a s**t about Toyota's revenue. I care about this vehicle and the outcome.
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2007 4X4 FJ AT
Keep your chin up, at least you're not driving a Chrysler product....
Glad you getting her back! We complain and worry about our FJ's but we still love em and I'm sure it was hard going without it. Hopefully they will be able to tell you more about a possible cause and if they think this was a long term solution to the problem.
__________________ Shark
Vehicles are not the only thing recalled by their Maker.
Glad you getting her back! We complain and worry about our FJ's but we still love em and I'm sure it was hard going without it. Hopefully they will be able to tell you more about a possible cause and if they think this was a long term solution to the problem.
If q80fj, with the New Revised Inner Fender Panels, is having the same bulging and tearing issues that we have had, than there is a high chance MudLoving, Cruiser Larry, and Myself will have the New Revised Crumple Zone Inner Fender Panel Skirts bulge and tear again.
My Service Director confirmed that the parts used to repair our vehicles are the same "Revised Crumple Zone" Inner Fender Panels that are on the Late 07' Model FJs and the 08 FJ's. Namely, the same part that is bulging and tearing on q80fj's truck.
The Inner Fender Panel Skirt replacement, some of us have received, is most likely not a solution to the problem. If the revised crumple zones are tearing as well for q80fj, it is highly possible that the root cause has not been addressed.
Furthermore, IF the New Inner Fender Panel Skirts are further reinforced, will damage from the Body Flex Stresses manifest themselves further along the crumple areas of our vehicles?
If you look at the Collision Repair Manual, you will see the stresses from an accident travel through the engine bay and up through the A-Pillars around the windshield, and then up through the roof. Will we soon see, or fail to see, damage spreading ot these areas?
It’s been awhile since I posted in this thread, but I feel compelled to do so. The inner fender on the driver’s side of my FJ was replaced last April. The bulge returned within a few months and now a crack has developed. I am considering asking for a new FJ. I have many modifications and dread the idea of starting over modifying a new FJ.
So as you all know the dealership called FJ Widow and me and said, bring it in and get it fixed. So I talked with the service manger who was quite rude to me. I asked what was causing the problem and got "I don't know" i asked, how could you fix a problem if you don't know the cause. he said "You can either bring it in or don't". After taking a deep breath I moved on to Toyota 1-800 were I got an even ruder lady so I moved on again and found someone who would actually do their job with some respect. She called up Tech support and told me they said it was from mods and off roading it to hard, I explained to her just as many stock pavement only FJ's show the same bulge/rip. She then said she would call me back. I got the call and she revised her statement to "we don't know the cause of the problem but we our working on it". Funny two hours earlier it was my fault. I explained I was very concerned that they want to fix it without knowing the cause, plus it has to be done outside of Toyota at a body shop. She told me I had to contact the dealer to contact the rep to meet up IN 2-3 weeks AGAIN.
I don't know what to do.. Take my Chance on the fix from some body shop or sit and wait..
Also, I am under the assumption that if a manufacturer has to outsource a warranty repair it has to be done under contract with the shop who has been trained by the manufacturer on that repair. state to state the laws might very. Can anyone give me some insight to this????
I wonder if by outsourcing it is a form of passing the buck for a future problem??
Quote:
edadis previously said:
Toyota has how many decades of automotive design experience, including 4x4? Their designers and engineers have to be among the best in the world. It is nearly inconceivable to me that they don't know what is going on here. At a minimum, they have to have a pretty good idea.
In my judgment, the problem is that the FIX will require a significant redesign of components and Toyota simply isn't sure of how to proceed. More to the point, they don't know what to do with the early production models. Replace parts and hope that works? Initiate a buy-back program of some type, pro-rated to mileage?
I simply can't believe that they are clueless as to the cause, and fix. Even without examining affected parts, their engineers have to know the stresses and conditions that would cause these issues.
I believe you are 100% correct.
Quote:
MudLovingFJ previously said:
my truck is almost ready! i cant wait!
Don't be getting it too dirty on the first day......
It’s been awhile since I posted in this thread, but I feel compelled to do so. The inner fender on the driver’s side of my FJ was replaced last April. The bulge returned within a few months and now a crack has developed. I am considering asking for a new FJ. I have many modifications and dread the idea of starting over modifying a new FJ.
I am sorry to hear that your replacement fender panel ALSO failed. Was it the panel with the revised crumple zone placement? I was afraid that would happen.
THIS IS EVIDENCE THAT TOYOTA HAS NOT PROPERLY EVALUATED THE SOLUTION TO THE ROOT CAUSE OF THIS ISSUE, YET...I have confidence that they will in the future.
Please keep us posted as to how the Dealer deals with your situation.
11 chicken necks installed to date
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