We'll try and minimize variables. Try and select a test area that's safe to repeat the same lines. It should be a challenging obstacle, but not one that will make the climb dangerous or risky. It should test how the vehicle handle the terrain and not how driver skill affect the outcome. Maybe it will take a few runs to get somewhat comfortable with the said obstacle, but it should be one that everyone can do with reasonable assurance of no damage to the vehicle or body. For example, if we're challenging a hill ascent with rocks and sand, it should be the same line. The judging criteria would be how "easy" the rig ascend the hill and how the vehicle behave during the ascend. Did it feel surefooted? Is it articulating with poise? Excessive lean? Then it can be scored from 1-5 with subjective comments inserted. 1 would be simple. 5 would be failure to ascend. The same system can be applied to desert run. 1 be smooth, 5 be intolerable. The runs can be conducted at various speeds to get a better feel.
Still working on it. I'm welcoming all inputs and more volunteers please!
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I would be very interested in the results too... I think. But I don't think this will happen fast enough for me as I'm dying to get my suspension upgraded.
In truth, I'm considering the OME after reading tons of reviews and the cost point makes more sense for me right now. It'll spare me some dosh for the new set of tires. I can hardly wait!
How does one's skill play in to the decision? what type of criteria would one follow to rate / judge each setup?
if you simply go out and test a product, using 30 percent of it's limit, you learn nothing
some of the terrain we are discussing going over most guys are not even be feeling the suspensions but will be to busy trying to figure out the lines to take or the correct way to get over something, a experienced guy will be able to know what to do and how it should feel if it is working.
that is why, what might feel correct to some, is actually all wrong once the skills are up there.
first off Froggy, I never said they would not handle it,
I said the DRs are better and I will stand behind that
it is in the basic design of the shock
WEs are of a progressive valve design
DRs are of a Digressive vavle design
what that means is the faster you push the DRs the softer they are to become, and for that reason they can work faster to asorb the motion of fast running
The WEs will not react as much as they are design to energy in that many, but to stop it faster, a rougher ride at speed than the DRs.
either will kick a stock shock because of design
now because of this, the WE is a more stable design when hutting larger obsticles at slow speed and will dampen much faster than the DR, so when you jump up on the Larger rocks, not those little basket ball size ones but the ones like this,
the WEs are going dampen sooner that the Drs and let the motion of the body be less, hence less Bangs.
Now when you take that as the WEs suck in the desert you are not listening, Ask Terry, he will tell you that the DRs will out perform the WEs at speed in the desert. He will also tell you for 90 percent of the wheeling out there the WEs will out perform the DRs. He will also tell you most guys will never push the rig hard enuff to tell the difference.
I by any means have no brand loyalty, look at my set ups of my rigs, one jeep set up to pound rocks, one FJC set up to run the desert, both with 2 different approaches to suspension technology including the Shock valving, and to tell you the truth, I am about to rip the DRs out from under the FJC and replace it with the All Pro set up.
Do not ever blind yourself to a loyalty based on purchase choice. I have a 2900 dollar basic lift under the Jeep that can be out performed by a 1300 dollar lift in the desert. I know that for a fact, have owned both, but it is design purpose that made me change one for another.
Thanks for the explanation Jim. I think I understand the valving now. Makes sense. I'm just offering up the fact that my ride with the WEs at 55-75mph was "floating" up and down the washes in AB. And I love the performance they give me while crawling on rock. =)
Thanks for the explanation Jim. I think I understand the valving now. Makes sense. I'm just offering up the fact that my ride with the WEs at 55-75mph was "floating" up and down the washes in AB. And I love the performance they give me while crawling on rock. =)
Thanks for laying it down like that Apple Beans.
75 mph in a wash in AB! I call bulls#@t. You might of hit 75mph for a nanosecond before you about s@#t your pants and shut it down.
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i can do this wheneve as long as i have at least a week notice before we plan on doing it.
and no, i dont have the origional wheels/tires anymore.
I have a set. You can use them for the tests. Not sure how this test will rule out subjectivity, but I'm curious as to your endeavor. I say go for it. The tires have 14K miles on them. Keep that in mind. If something better comes along, use them, but my offer stands if not.
Another thing...if you could do it blind, like when tasting wine, that would help with a consensus gut feel for the suspension. Perhaps it's one driver (rig owner) and a passenger that "tests" the suspension. I don't know...food is like this, wine is too. There's a lot of subjectivity, like in these suspensions, but I think there's merit in compiling opinions and real hands-on user experience. I wouldn't expect a scientific based analysis, but more of a subjective one which is not to say it won't have value. Also like with wine, you don't have to be an expert to appreciate what it has to offer and to have an opinion. Of course you guys on this forum are not short on opinions, so you know that.
75 mph in a wash in AB! I call bulls#@t. You might of hit 75mph for a nanosecond before you about s@#t your pants and shut it down.
IT was a range. Stop trying to bust my balls. I've heard you say and I quote "you were hauling ass Froggy" and it was on Fonts wash.
I'll go head to head with you anyday in identical vehicles Scott. So whenever you want to put your money where your mouth is.... There is a great cart track down here. I'd love to see what happens on a timed course with identical vehicles where we don't have to worry about damaging our DDs.
Re: Suspension answers once and for all.
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