Been reading through some threads here and I'm ready to take the plunge and install my first aftermarket audio setup. What I put in will probably last a good number of years, so I'm willing to splurge a bit if the difference in quality is appreciable. I will be commissioning a shop to do the install.
I listen mainly to pop, R&B, jazz, light rock and some opera/broadway and a little house and club. Am not really into rap and definitely not into heavy metal. I would definitely like a setup leaning towards SQ rather than loudness. I want my sub tight and punchy but definitely not overly loud and teeth-loosening
These are the parts I'm considering for the FJ, and some questions:
Speakers (from lowest-priced to highest-priced):
JL Audio C5-650 (2-way) or C5-653 (3-way)
Focal Elite KRX2 (2-way) or Morel Elate 602 (2-way)
Focal Elite KRX3 (3-way) or Morel Elate 603 (3-way)
>> How big of a difference are the 3-ways vs. the 2-ways for these?
>> How big of a quality difference between the JL C5 to these Focals or Morels, considering the latter are a big step up in cost?
>> Between JL C5-653 3-way and Focal KRX2 2-way, i.e. midrange 3-way vs. high-end 2-way, which would be "better"?
>> For 2-way comps I plan to install in the stock door position and the tweeter in the stock dash locations, and for 3-way comps I plan to install the woofer in the doors, mids in the dash and tweeters flat into the A-pillars (facing the other A-pillar -- as I don't really want an intrusive pod). Are these good ideas?
Subs:
JL Audio W6v3 10" or 12"
Focal Utopia 27KX 10" or 33KX 12"
Morel Ultimo 10" or 12"
JL Audio 12W7AE-3 12"
>> Which would you recommend among these?
>> Would a 12" be "better" (12" versions of these models), considering my music and preference for tight but not overpowering bass?
Amps (5-channel): lowest to highest priced
Alpine PDX-V9
Hertz HDP5
Audison Prima 5.9
JL Audio HD900/5
>> Would the more expensive amps in this list be worth the added cost compared to the lower priced ones?
Source will be a top-end Pioneer unit
This will be my first-ever foray into aftermarket audio, so will greatly appreciate advice. Thanks everyone! :grin
hey man glad to help you out ... First off the 3 way component system is very very tricky to setup correctly (custom APillars etc)I would steer you toward a 2 way component system first being by the time you get everything you need you're looking at headunit/amps/component speakers/sound deadening etc your looking at about 2000.00 and up before install ... And with a 2 channel setup all you need is a 3 channel amp or one 2 channel amp and a mono amp for the sub .... So let's do this steps at a time being it's very important to match the right gear up per speakers amps etc .... Ok on the component speakers I really really like the JL C5s I just put a set in my Honda Civic and I'm blown away how good they sound so no I do not think it's worth spending the extra on the Focals etc but you might consider the JL ZR 2 way components excellent stuff and you can bi-amp them so with a sub the JL HD 900/5 would run the complete system
on the sub what is your plan on location ? Back cargo area or on the side ? This will make a difference in what we pic and again I would recommend the JL W6 (amazing SQ) and on size depends on location ?
Ok on the amp let's figure out the component speakers setup and sub first before we decide
Link me the headunit you are considering ... Or would you consider a Alpine headunit?
Then you need at least 100 sq. ft. Of sound deadening , I like the Rattle Trap/Fat Mat 80mm , JL bass knob , amp kit etc
To give you an idea on 3 way components here are my Focal 165 KRX3s and I'm running a JL W7 12" in a custom ported box with 2 amps running the system JL HD 600/4 bi-amped to run the Focals and a JL HD 750/1 running the sub then a high end Alpine INE 927HD headunit... Invest was a around 8500.00
Thanks so much ZoSoIV, I've read your recommendations on some of the other threads too.
I'd like a stealthy setup that looks closest to oem as possible, so sub in the cargo bay on one side (other side remaining open to keep luggage space).
If I go 3-way up front (whichever brand), will it be okay to put the mid driver in the stock dash locations (pointing upwards towards the dash) and then the tweeters in the a pillars as ZoSoIV shows in his photo? -- I love your setup with both drivers on the pillar but I'm worried it might be too attractive to thieves or something
Thanks so much ZoSoIV, I've read your recommendations on some of the other threads too.
I'd like a stealthy setup that looks closest to oem as possible, so sub in the cargo bay on one side (other side remaining open to keep luggage space).
If I go 3-way up front (whichever brand), will it be okay to put the mid driver in the stock dash locations (pointing upwards towards the dash) and then the tweeters in the a pillars as ZoSoIV shows in his photo? -- I love your setup with both drivers on the pillar but I'm worried it might be too attractive to thieves or something
As far as active vs passive I like the passive much better for simplicity active can be very tricky to setup correctly and you can spend hours with RTA pink noise and micing the front seat to get it right where as the JL Focal passive crossover setup is pretty much plug and play and your set and sound just as good
In my pic the 3" mids and tweeters are in the APillars then I have a "7 inch midbass in the doors ... On putting the tweeters in the a pillars and 3" mid in the dash that's a negative being the mid and tweeter MUST be within a few inches of each other , they will not image correctly otherwise ... On the sub since you want to mount it on the ledge I would stick with a JL 10"W6 in a sealed box which would give you great output and excellent SQ and would balance the front stage nicely , the shallow mount aren't quite enough output for me ... I would still probably push you toward the 2 way components either the JL C5 or ZR the ZRs would be super nice
Just a thought on subs - you say you want to keep the bass tight and punchy...I just installed a JL 8w1v3 shallow mount sub. The box is custom to the exact dimensions, and it sounds amazing with only 100 watts RMS running to it. I really don't think you want to go with anything bigger than a 10" because your side mounting area will not have enough volume or mounting depth for you to make it flush with the surface below and not stick up over the sill of the gray side panel.
With the 8", I got it to even be recessed so that with the grille, it still barely sticks out (link if interested). Also, keep in mind that with a W6, you need a very deep mounting depth, so it will definitely not look stock.
This system is all about sq and aside from the sub is all in the oem locations and total stealth. I wanted the minimal amount of drivers pushing air in different directions, hence active components. Sounds like I have a set of Genelecs in the FJ. This system sounds good at all listening levels and I'm usually pretty mellow but it will cause hearing damage quickly with how loud it can get.
Alpine HD149BT single DIN head unit
Audison Bit 10 (crossovers, time alignments, EQ. This thing is amazing.)
Hertz HDP 5
Hertz Mille 280.3 hi freq drivers
Hertz Mille 1800.3 (yes these fit in the doors)
JL Audio 12W6v3 (bigger than you want, sub volume controlled with the alpine. From musically accurate all the way to shake your teeth loose.)
Lots of deadening in the doors and rear cargo walls and floor.
Good point on the sub box volume, thanks! Ill probably go for a 10".
Ive read about active vs passive crossovers, are the crossovers that come with the JL c5 focal k2p etc passive or active? The JL and focal websites dont feature any standalone crossovers -- why is that?
Last question regarding tweeter on pillar and mids on stock dash corners, is it just a matter of distance or should they also be on the same plane? I.e. Can i put the mid in the dash and the tweets low on the pillar (if all thats needed is for them to be just a few inches apart?)?
Nope still wouldn't image correctly , yes need to be on the same plane , putting them low on the APillar would not sound great and would give you a poor sound stage ...you would need to build a custom fiberglass APillar like I have ... As I said a two way component setup is much simpler
yeah on the 3 way component setup there is absolutely No room for error setting them up or orherwise they won't sound good at all..
On the amps all of them are excellent with the Focal and sub you would need a 3 channel amp setup also with the Focal the tweeters tend to run a little bright ... On the JL ZR two way components you're able to bi-amp them so with a sub a 5 channel amp would be worth doing so I would recommend the JL 900/5 for this setup ... I'm almost positive you would like the tweeters better with the JL ZRs (smoother) and based on what you listen to I would push you more toward the ZRs
Back to the amps the Audison is probably the best JL being as good and Alpine being 3rd but there all great amps with the ZRs an JL 10" W6 the JL 900/5 would be my first pick then the Audison
Thanks, okay I'm a little confused on what you said about the amps -- if the Audison is probably the "best" among what I mentioned then why the recommendation for the JL HD900/5 if paired with ZRs and a W6, and not the Audison?
Reason I'm keen on it is that the Audison is significantly less expensive than the HD900/5
Got lost a bit regarding bi-amping JL ZR 2-ways... what does that mean and why is it possible with the ZRs and not with the Focals?
Noted on your opinion that the Focals are relatively brighter. Sounds like they would be harsher and more fatiguing to the ear on a road trip especially with female vocals. Any opinions on Morel Elates and Hertz Mille (as someone else recommended here) versus the JL ZRs?
Noted on your opinion that the Focals are relatively brighter. Sounds like they would be harsher and more fatiguing to the ear on a road trip especially with female vocals. Any opinions on Morel Elates and Hertz Mille (as someone else recommended here) versus the JL ZRs?
The ZR and W6 pair up better with the JL 900/5 via wattage they will handle ... The JL is just as good IMO as the Audison and a excellent match with the ZRs and the Hertz components would pair up better with the Audsion amp
On the Hertz there excellent speakers and a lot of that comes down to personal choice but IMO again I just think the JL are more musically/lively than the Heztz BUT with what you listen to you couldn't go wrong with the hertz ... The Moral I haven't listened to in ages so an opinion on them is harder I do know there an excellent quality speaker but man there pricey almost double the ZRs and again would come down to personal taste ... And I know it's almost impossible to listen to all three brands so it's a tough choice but you can't go wrong with any of them
Ok another good opinion great and I'm a huge blues based hard rock fan so the Focal and ZRs work for me... Merck What's your opinion on the C5 silk dome components compared to he ZRs , I like both equally as well myself
I listened to them as well and I personally liked the silk.
I should qualify I know very little about car audio, so I defer to your expertise. This is the first stereo other than oem I have ever had.
I've been an audio engineer for almost 30 years now, with the hearing damage to prove it, hah. So I just went and listened to stuff as best I could, because everyone's hearing is so subjective.
I had never even heard of Hertz before I went to the shop, but that's what won out to my ears.
I decided to go with the bit 10 processor and an active system so that each amp channel is working on only the freq range each specific speaker needs. It's like current active studio monitor design. Very efficient. Having the sub and all components time aligned is great as I can't hear any issues with phase cancellation etc.
I had the shop program the bit 10, because as ZOSO mentioned it can be a challenge. But these guys do it all the time. I told them I just wanted it totally flat in the driver's seat and it sounds really good. I've heard "good" car stereo gear that just sounds like it has a huge smiley face EQ built in. This sounds flat.
And use good quality cables! It really does matter. They are expensive but it does no good to have killer components strung together with cheap wire that will drop power and cut your frequency response on both hi and low.
Yeah that is why I brought up speakers a lot of times come down to personal choice I mean any high end component you're going to be happy with but the small details of each brand sets them apart that's the thing about choice lol... The active vs the passive crossovers is personal taste also and you can get excally the right signal to each driver with either , I myself find the active just to big a pain in the ass to setup whereas the passive is much easier and you don't nessacerily have to mic the system with an RTA/Pink Noise and most higher end headunits have the ability for the time alignment etc and have excellent EQs to tweek the system out ... That's is one thing I like about the Alpine headunit they have a TuneIt app that you can use a tweek it perfectly and its money! I just love it
What does a Bit 10 / Bit 10 D do? I looked at Audison's website but I can't tell from it if it is something I should invest in
If suppose someone is on a budget, would you generally recommend prioritizing a higher-end amp over higher-end speakers (i.e. higher-end amp with midrange speakers vs. midrange amp with higher-end speakers)?
The Bit10 is a Sound Processer with a passive 2 way component system I would not recommend them ...I find there more helpful for say a higher end stock system like in a BMW Mercedes-Benz that are running 8 speakers setup etc ... Yes I like matching up gear as closely as possibly JL Components with JL amps , Hertz speakers with Hertz amps makes for a more balanced system
that all hinges on what you want to spend ...IMO i think you would be more than happy with the JL C5 two way components(which would be 1000.00 less than the Morels) with the 10" W6 sub in a sealed box with a JL HD 600/4 amp (in 3 channel mode)running the complete system...OH I forget to add the Focal Utopia two way components if you have 5500.00 to spend on 3 way components or 2000.00 for the two way components lol
Haha I know! Im gonna get a recommendation from the shop too but looks like Ill go with either C5 2-ways and keep everything else in the midrange price-wise...
...or go whole hog and upgrade everything into the high end if i convince myself that spending more money on gear will make me feel better
Fortunately, I plan to keep this truck for a veeeery long time so I wouldnt really mind
is it better to have a dedicated mono amp for the sub? I am really liking what I read about the Morel Ultimo sub, but have read that they are quite power hungry (rated at 1000W at 2 ohms and 4 ohms). Is running at 4 ohms more desirable than 2 ohms, reduced power aside?
I've not listed to the Morel subs but I'm sure they sound great but i would about bet they don't sound any better than a JL W6 ...yes they rated at 1000W but what you want to look at is the RMS which is 600W unless you plan on listening to it at 140 db and above a huge huge amp isn't necessary the JL HD 750/1 would run it fine ...running 4 ohm vs 2 ohm is a none issue, the issue would be matching up the driver with the amp say the sub is rated a 2 ohm you would want to make sure the amp was capable of a 2 ohm load ...example my JL 12" W7 is rated at 3 ohm and my JL 750/1 is stable down to 1.5 ohms so boom perfect match ...thats why i said we can hold off on the amp/s till we figure out for sure what component speaker/sub you're getting then we match that speaker combo up with the right amp/s
I've read all sorts of good things about Alpine HUs but they dont seem to have any nice new products with apple carplay and android auto. So looking at Pioneer 4200NEX instead
The only Alpine I might consider is the Alpine ILX-007 with Apple Carplay, but I think I'd prefer the flexibility of Pioneer's NEX units
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