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sway bar link, cv boot and warranty

13K views 91 replies 34 participants last post by  spincycle 
#1 ·
So, the passenger sway bar link snapped, then proceeded to shred the outer CV boot.





Boulder Toyota refuses to cover under warranty because of the Total Chaos UCA's I have installed, this according to their district manager... Bravo to the tech who disagrees, but is being overridden.
 
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#7 ·
Me too. We need to complain to corporate. If they offer and promote rock crawling on the rubicon then we should be able to get a refund when this happens.
RANT

A warranty is "if it's defective, we'll fix it". Not "if it breaks, we'll fix it".

The cycle is Wheel it, break it, fix it, wheel it. get it?

If you complain, then they will just stop showing off their FJ doing cool stuff (professional drivers do it correctly so they don't break it ;) ) or stop selling 4x4's to the rest of the people that know how to drive and know how to fix what they break.

/rant
 
#13 ·
Saturday, August 4, 2007, 4:30pm, Farmington, NM. At the time the link actually snapped, I was driving down a dirt road. I heard the "PING!", but thought it was just a stone.

RANT

A warranty is "if it's defective, we'll fix it". Not "if it breaks, we'll fix it".

The cycle is Wheel it, break it, fix it, wheel it. get it?

If you complain, then they will just stop showing off their FJ doing cool stuff (professional drivers do it correctly so they don't break it ;) ) or stop selling 4x4's to the rest of the people that know how to drive and know how to fix what they break.

/rant
Wow, I'm so tempted to bite and b!tch back, but since you've already assumed I don't know how to drive or fix anything, what would be the point??

So, have a nice day!:pinklove:

Regardless, it wouldn't hurt Toyota to back up their best off-road rig attempt with some love for those who use it.
 
#6 ·
I noticed a couple of weeks ago that my passanger link is bent, guess it's only a matter of time before it snaps.
 
#8 ·
Get a replacement link ASAP, before it ends up
costing you a bundle !...
 
#9 ·
As much as I hate to, I agree with the stealership.

It looks like you have modified your suspension quite a bit. Im assuming a lift (looks like OMEs), and upper arms, your suspension was probably flexing more and putting more strain on the sway bar than the stock link was engineered for.

sorry for your misfortune, my rig is currently down also getting a new t-case
 
#10 ·
Man that sucks!!!! I would tell them you are going to blog to holy hell if they don't cover it!!!!!

I had a bent link and replaced it before the summit, so before going wheeling make sure to check all components, after awhile it becomes second nature:D Look for loose bolts and bent items, it's saved my arse more than once now:)

good luck!!!
 
#11 ·
There have been enough problems with this with enough people that to me it's not so much a warranty issue as a SOLUTION issue. What can we do, make, fab or install to fix the problem because NONE of us want to have this happen on the trail.
 
#12 ·
I couple of good size heims that match the OE
bolt size would prolly do nicely... OR maybe a
set of polly bushings with a welded tube...
 
#14 ·
I heard a rumor that TC has a drop link to compensate for this issue, but I haven't heard back from them yet.
 
#16 ·
Given that this seems to be a "likely" issue to experience, if any, what is the out of pocket expense to repairing something like this?

I don't know nearly enough to argue whether or not this is a defect or a true breakage, so I won't go there. However, I am interested in knowing what can be done to prevent this and what kind of cash I can expect to spend fixing it ;)

Like I said, I'm newer to this whole wheeling thing than most. Nonetheless, I understood from the get-go that damage can and does happen. Like MissFJ said - Wheel it, break it, fix it, wheel it.
 
#24 ·
The boot kit is a whopping $30+, but the labor to replace it is $300+. The sway bar link is $80+ and is an easy bolt on/off deal for the driveway.

Sorry, dude. I use the quote button to be specific about who I'm talking too :) I'm not trying to stomp on your misfortune.
Thx, no worries. I'm all about culpability, but I can't stand the inconsistency in application of philosophy and policy... Having a Toyota tech on the trail say take it in an get it fixed under warranty, the guy at the dealer service door say the same thing, then get reversed up the chain and waste 2 days not getting anything fixed... I love bureaucracy :D
 
#21 ·
I suppose the lesson to be learned is to simply remove the front sway-bar for serious wheeling. Since it's only about a ten minute job it's not all that much trouble; inconvenient yes, but still not much trouble. I always remove mine in Moab; but I don't bother in Ouray. Going to the trouble in the future might prevent similar mishaps down the road, since the sway bar doesn't appear to be designed to withstand a great deal of abuse.

Jim
 
#31 ·
I suppose the lesson to be learned is to simply remove the front sway-bar for serious wheeling. Since it's only about a ten minute job it's not all that much trouble; inconvenient yes, but still not much trouble. I always remove mine in Moab; but I don't bother in Ouray. Going to the trouble in the future might prevent similar mishaps down the road, since the sway bar doesn't appear to be designed to withstand a great deal of abuse.

Jim
I have been convinced. So how far has anyone got with a disconnect?
 
#22 ·
Good advice.
 
#23 ·
This is why there are sway bar disconnects. The broken sway bar link is a result of increased articulation from lift kits. You have increased the potential torsion on the sway bar which increases the tensile strain on the link. You have surpassed the yield strength of the link. You either need to strengthen the link (which may result in a failure elsewhere) or eliminate the loading (through a disconnect). A smaller bar would also take care of it, but your on road handling would suffer tremendously. It sounds like there is a market for an in-cab electric disconnect system for the FJ's (this is what gives the Jeep rubis their advantage). How about front and rear so we can put heavier sway bars on the rear axle to improve on road handling (the rear sway bar is really small). I may have an idea or two. My problem is too many projects, not enough time, but if there is money involved, I have some resources.
 
#25 ·
I got beat to the punch by Jim D, I typically take mine off if I know that I'm going to be "pushing" it. As he stated, it is an easy job and I can notice the difference. The one thing I get concerned about sans swaybar is that it acts as a kind of "limit strap" so I'm careful to not put the wheels so that they drop too far and put the CV's in a "bad" angle.

As far as the warranty issue, without trying to cause too much debate...I agree in the fact that Toyota should cover things as advertised and promoted. Yet, a "modified" suspension is not a factory set up and I would find it an interesting discussion how one might explain how putting a lift on would NOT stress factory parts they are attached to. Clearly, this part is being stressed under "hard" wheeling on a lifted vehicle.

I think it was worth asking but you had to know the answer before you even asked. Just because the "minions" thought it was a good idea to swap it out with Toyota's wallet wouldn't convince those that hold the purse strings.

Sorry to hear you had the problem but it does us all good so we can work together to find a long term solution to this issue for those of us how have modified their suspensions...
 
#26 ·
Ok so with lets say an average 2-3 inch suspension lift up front, would we need to fab a longer link? If so how much longer over the stock link. I like my sway bar connected. I'd much rather fab something that will work correctly with my lift. This seems like an easy fab job. I'm surprised that none of the FJ after market companies aren't capitalizing on this.
 
#27 ·
Its not the issue of longer really, it's that we
are getting better articulation out of our lifts
then we did when it was stock, in other words
more movement difference between left and
right sides which causes more pressure on the
links due the the increased twisting of the
sway bar...

Now stronger links at the same size would be
great and easy for a company to fab up a kit...
The reason they have not, is this has not been
a real big issue till recently...
 
#30 ·
Looking for input on this but don't you guys think that disconnecting the front sway bar puts a whole lot of stress on the cv joints at full droop? It's either take disconnect the sway bar and risk damaging the cv/boot, or leaving it and breaking the link, thus tearing up your boot.
Adding a limiting strap will fix that issue
right there, so there would be no over
extending them... but on a stock UCA
setup, the upper ball joint binding will
limits the droop in the front....
 
#36 ·
Anyone have idea of what's the tensile strength of the bolt that's currently in doubt?
 
#37 ·
Bolt ?... I believe it's the Link bar itself that
is the weak link, that is all that I has seen
broke thus far... So some nice strong links,
Nice Heavy Duty MoFo's would do the trick...
 
#40 ·
Argh, I was under the impression it was the bolt that held the sway bar links to the bar that sheared. kk. got it. Maybe we can check to see if Tundra uses a similar bar or a stronger one.
 
#43 · (Edited)
An option would be to Sleeve the existing link in
order to make it a thicker rod, but then you would
have to see if the joints themselves could take
the force... Its obvious that they can take more
the the links themselves, so it may work well...
 
#44 ·
Ive been swaybar-less since spring, and even at full droop, the angle on the CV isnt that severe. Even if it was, you have to remember, at full droop, theres usually no traction at that wheel. I have Sway-a-way coilovers, and they have a limiting stop built in anyway. I believe most of the other coilovers on the market have it as well.

The benefit you mostly see is the side to side difference. I can have the driverside at full stuff, and the passenger drooping. It really helps keep the truck level

On road handling is fine for me with the SAW's. theyre a bit firmer than the stock springs so it doesnt lean that much, even with the rear off as well.
 
#45 · (Edited)
Does anyone know how the Lexus KDSS is set up on the GX?

Safer (and Sportier) Utility Vehicles

Thai mentioned it in another thread, and I've never been able to find pics of how it's set up. I found this one:



found this quote on the lexusowners club forum: Supereasy to tell the difference from KDSS and NON-KDSS. Look under the front of the GX, KDSS sway bar is over 2" thick and bolts to the lower contol arm. NON-KDSS sway bar is about 1.3 " thick and has end links that bolt to the steering knuckle. KDSS also has a different skidplate that has a wire mesh screen on it. NON-KDSS has a solid metal skidplate.
 
#46 ·
I watched their video and demo of how it works. Apparently, it hydralic where the fluid is allowed to flow when turned on. The valves allow the fluid to flow from the high pressure wheel (being compressed) to the low pressure wheel (being off-weighted) and allowing more articulation. At least, that is what I gathered from the Lexus website. Nothing we could retrofit but its clearly an answer the engineers have come up with to compensate for the issue.
 
#47 ·
Thanks coach,
I watched the "dumbed down" public explanation in the video too. $1750 OUCH

There has to be something more to it than that though......as it was explained it sounds kind of similar to the cross-vehicle function of the X-REAS on the 4Runner.

There is more to the story though, the KDSS sway bar is a lot thicker. It has to be released somehow if it is to work like they say it does.

Oh well, obviously they figured the bar has to be mounted differently and connected to the lower arm. The non-KDSS GX looks similar to the FJ's.
 
#51 ·
More news... I've talked to two dealerships in the Denver area, one that installs OME and covers it under warranty, another that installs TC and covers it under warranty, so it's not the after market that should present a problem.

The sticking point is a ding on the link bar that I don't believe was contemporaneous to the actual breakage, but we can all hear that conversation over and over again...

"Is too! Is not! Is too! Is not!"

I'll fix it, get it fixed, beg for forgiveness, perhaps get sympathy from Toyota and be pleased that this thread has garnered so much interest, information and hopefully future solutions.
 
#52 ·
More news... I've talked to two dealerships in the Denver area, one that installs OME and covers it under warranty, another that installs TC and covers it under warranty, so it's not the after market that should present a problem.
Now is that true regardless of who installs it or are they only covering vehicles they install the OME or TC lift kits on?

Personally the only time I've seen aftermarket items covered (especially non-Toy products) is when that particular dealership installed it...and it was hit or miss if any other Toy dealer would do any warranty work on it.
 
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