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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #1
I violated a cardinal rule for my FJC - I decided to install a major piece myself, rather than having it done by people who know what they're doing - my dad goaded me into it since he did heavy vehicle construction for a living during the 60's - early 80's and I think it's an endless source of amusement to him that I've never done an honest day's work (labour) in my life :)

Actually, it turned out OK (alright, yeah, it's a little saggy in the middle). So here for your viewing pleasure: my installation of a Lucrum swingout tire carrier on an AllPro rear bumper, with a Man-A-Fre aux fuel tank for extra difficulty points.

First off, removed the AllPro bumper. This sucker is held on with four bolts to the fame on the outside edges (two on each side) and six bolts to the middle of the rear frame, in my case located along with the tailer ball joint mount. The two outer bolts on each side resisted moving mightily. Eventually we broke the retaining nut on the inside of the frame, so they spun uselessly. That then called for drilling them out. That got the bolts out (or in in a couple of cases), but we'd eventually have to replace the mounting system. Since the frame is boxed, we ended up creating small entrance holes in the ends, just sufficient to get the dead bolts out and replace them. The reason for the failure became clear on inspection of the retaining bolts, which turn out to be held in place within the frame by tiny spot welds. The replacement was a bolt placed in the frame with a washer. Tightening later occurred by gripping the bolt bottom while twisting the nut on. Seemed to work OK.

The clips for the reversing sensors seemed like a pain until we discovered that you simply push down on the outside of one of the end pieces on the connector (located along the wires, near the body mounts). After that, off the bumper came nice and easy. It's been on for 3 years, and the inside was rather rusty. More on that a few AllPro mods later on.

Bumper off:


Success - the reversing sensor wire connector:


Inspecting the underside:


One of our problems was going to be that the mount pins for the swing out needed to go where the MAF aux tank mounts already were:



The main mounting arms go on top of the frame in a tight area. Finding the right alignment was a bit of a pain. We experimented with holding the pieces on with a G clamp and inspecting:



One thing we noted when the bumper was off is just how well the MAF aux tank is cradled by the frame - knew it all along, but had not seen it before:




The top of the frame, where the Lucrum swingout arms are to be located is not smooth due to the fact that it's sheet steel that's been welded. The welds can be at all angles, and we ended up getting a grinder out and smoothing it off (missed photos of that).

The other thing we had to do was a fair amount of plastic cutting of the trim along the outside of the door frame. In particular, there is a small metal bracket bolted on that's part of the tie-down for the door entrance trim - most of that got removed as it was forcing the swing out too far back for the AllPro bumper to sit back on snuggly. I missed photo documenting much of that, too. Sorry :( But you can see the result over on the lower left hand side of the door frame in the last picture, above, where much of that trim is gone.

While the bumper was off, we took advantage of access to deal with the AllPro bumper rust. We wire brushed out the interior and applied some POR 15 (hence also the dirty hand problem).




I had long ago had some Man-A-Fre D-brackets put on the rear bumper, but indecision over how to mount them left false bolts in the brackets, which were held on only with welds. The issue is that the frame pulls away from the bumper at the location of the brackets, so bolting through the frame isn't possible. We ended up deciding that some good strong bolts through the bumper would be better than nothing.





Back to the swing out. Having followed the instructions to get the mounts as far towards the front of the vehicle as possible, it was time to drill some nice 1/2" holes. On both sides, we had to additionally go through the MAF aux tank mounting bracket as well as the frame.




The drilling of the mounts ended up being the biggest pain of the project - which is to say the whole thing wasn't too bad - just took time.

With the mounts on, we maneuvered the AllPro bumper back in place.



The AllPro installation differs from most in that we can't use a secondary mount support because of the limited interior volume of the AllPro bumper. Instead, mounting holes on top of the swingout spindle plates must be bolted to the top of the bumper. This requires drilling into the top of the bumper and then tapping a thread into said holes. Finally, bolting the spindle plate down onto the AllPro bumper top.




 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #2
Next up was getting the spindles put together with their bearings and grease.








The spindle components need to be pressed together to keep the whole unit together an integral (i.e. holding in all that grease).

Starting to look like a swing out system:




There is a strip that used to link the rear door to the gas can swing out. The strip bolts to the lower set that in the stock setup hold the tire mount on the door. The strip is then used to house a little ball mount, which in turn links to a double ended ball socket system setup on a threaded rod. When I first was looking at the instruction photos, I thought I was missing a piece (I was looking for the completed ball socket rod) - in actuality, the part comes as the rod and two separate ball sockets. (Though read towards the end as I think I'm not going to use this system).





The locking mechanism to keep the swingout arms together comes in two parts. Least importantly, there is a pressure level arm that presses on the outside face of the tire arm from a mount on the gas tank arm:





More importantly, there is a brute force pin that goes vertically through both arms. This requires drilling the arms and screwing on a capture nut at the base:





One thing I worried about was clearance for the Gobi ladder I have on the back. This turns out not to be an issue as Chris has perfectly fit the gas tank arm around the ladder.






At this point I stopped to check out the departure angle. As you can see, it's not the limiter for departure. I only worry about falling of a ledge and slapping the tray base - it'd have to be a 4ft+ ledge, but, been-there-done-that, so we'll see.

 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #3
Intermediate zoomed out shots:








Next up was making up the gas can cage. I like the holding mechanism for the cans - it's like the tilting lid from as US mail box or a bear proof trash can. The only problem with it is it currently uses bolts and nuts - not very trail convenient (though it's possible I slid off the instructions as the faded in detail near the end). I'm going to think about some quicker release mechanism to get in - and one I'm less likely to loose bits from. The instructions were also unclear on which nuts to use where. I used some nice allen key bolts on the inside of the gas can carrier as it just kinda seemed the obvious thing to do. Maybe this is why it's not in the instructions.








The HiLift mount went on next, along the inside of the accessory rail nearest the vehicle centre:



To stop the tire swingout arm from becoming a pain in the butt swinging back into the open door, it has a gas pressure piston on the hinge. This mounts from a ball screwed into the axle base. The piston has a plastic sleeve that's fit over the thin portion of the piston when extended. The receiver ball is on a plate that needs to be screwed into the swingout arm with self-tapping screws, after a pilot hole has been drilled (it's actually on three screws).





The gas piston works really well. In fact, I really want to see if I can replicate it on the gas can side. As designed, the gas can arm opens naturally with the rear door (on the threaded two-ball socket system, mentioned above). The problem is I will often want to get the gas can arm out of the way so I can get to the roof with the Gobi ladder. The identical gas piston system would be ideal - unless I'm missing some reason why Chris didn't use it (likely given my mechanical prowess).

And that's it for now - still need to get the license plate relocation done.




Now the astute amongst you will have noticed that my install isn't perfect. In fact, the arms sag noticeably (and, to my girlfriend, hilariously). The reason for this is improper alignment of the original spindle arms. The problem for fixing this is that the fit with respect to the AllPro bumper is so tight that if we roll the mount brackets down (so as to level), we'll also have to lift the mounts. Further, the spindle plates are bolted to the top of the AllPro bumper so as to bring the plate and the bumper top plush. I'm worried about strength in terms of the sheer amount of packing I'd need to do under the mount on the frame and I'm also worried that it'd still get pulled off alignment by the pinching to the bumper. Also, I'm wicked lazy and don't want to take it all to pieces again. Anyway, checkout the tilt on the mounting plates that causes the problem. It's only aesthetic, and actually the mount on the frame and the compression at the arm contact mean I think this is probably as strong as I can make it. So overall, mixed results on my installation, but that's all down to my installation - the product is AWESOME!






This narrative is continued on post 16 of this thread.
 

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Very nice Mark! Way to jump in feet first for your first "real" work. :)
 

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Wow, thanks so much for posting an in-depth thread of the Lucrum install. I've been looking at this hard ever since it was released.

Looking forward to the finished product! :cheers:
 

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Awesome... This is the Lucrum swingout, VERY NICE... :bigthumb:
 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #7
Very nice Mark! Way to jump in feet first for your first "real" work. :)
Yeah - I'm still bummed about the "sag" though :(

Wow, thanks so much for posting an in-depth thread of the Lucrum install. I've been looking at this hard ever since it was released.

Looking forward to the finished product! :cheers:
Almost done now - just the license plate move

Awesome... This is the Lucrum swingout, VERY NICE... :bigthumb:
Chris did a great job with this. Hopefully people don't see my "butt" sagging and think it has anything to do with the quality of the kit.
 

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Nice work, Mark!:bigthumb: Looks like Chris put together another great product for the FJ. I can appreciate the work that can go into this knd of install and find it a wonder that you were patient enough to stop along the way to take some pics for our consumption. Thankyou! (I find it difficult to do so, personally, and constantly say to myself, "man I wish I had taken some photos of that in process for the forum...")
 

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Yeah - I'm still bummed about the "sag" though :(

Chris did a great job with this. Hopefully people don't see my "butt" sagging and think it has anything to do with the quality of the kit.
Hi mir207
Was not sure with your build if you are still running OME Heavy springs in the rear? So many suspension up grades in your build I was lost....awesome job by the way. If you are running OME heavys still will you be going to extra heavy rear springs? Currently I have a after market rear bumper with swing out, hilift carrier, fuel cans, shovel etc...etc. and it rides great with OME heavy springs and full cans etc....etc. However I too wish to add a auxiliary tank and feel that I would require the Extra Heavy OME springs at that point due to the spring rate for the OME heavy is only for a additional 300 lbs. You must be some where around the 400 lb extra in the rear? I believe the extra heavy OME's are rated for 400 lbs. Might want to consider it.
 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #11
Hi mir207
Was not sure with your build if you are still running OME Heavy springs in the rear? So many suspension up grades in your build I was lost....awesome job by the way. If you are running OME heavys still will you be going to extra heavy rear springs? Currently I have a after market rear bumper with swing out, hilift carrier, fuel cans, shovel etc...etc. and it rides great with OME heavy springs and full cans etc....etc. However I too wish to add a auxiliary tank and feel that I would require the Extra Heavy OME springs at that point due to the spring rate for the OME heavy is only for a additional 300 lbs. You must be some where around the 400 lb extra in the rear? I believe the extra heavy OME's are rated for 400 lbs. Might want to consider it.
Yeah, I've had the extra heavies on for almost two years. I have a very old thread where we put them on and tested to see how much flex we still got.
 

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Yeah, I've had the extra heavies ...
I still need to upgrade to the extra heavies, I
had to add 1-1/2" daystars to my heavies to
keep me close to level with the weight I carry...
 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #16
So still haven't done the license plate relocation, but did end up thinking some more about the gas-can arm and it's fixed relationship to the back door. This doesn't work for me since I want access to the ladder to get up to the back. Chris suggested I look at some quick release sockets from McMaster-Carr. The problem here is that they only have them for M6 threaded rod, while the rod used in the tie-down is M8 threaded (M8 x 1.25 FYI). I asked Chris if he felt my replacing the tie with M6 rod would be an issue - he thought for strength reasons I shouldn't drop the size. I checked a few other places, including Suspa, who make the tire-side gas spring (more on that later). I got very excited when Suspa had these very cool M6 and M8 quick release sockets for our 10mm ball mounts - problem was when I called to order them, they had none and did not know when they'd get them.

So in the end I ordered the M6 ones from McMaster-Carr. There's good clearance on the threaded piece, so I simply drilled it out ('H' bit) and M8 x 1.25 tapped it.





This is how it looks on the truck - to unlock the arm, you pull the arm out while holding the barrel, and then kind slide the ball out of the socket. Not the completely smoothest motion in the world, but MUCH better than trying to pull off the non-release ball socket.




Next up is putting a mirror of the tire carrier arm spring onto the gas can arm. Want that sucker to swing and smoothly when isolated from the rear door as the gas-can-side arm.




After that, using the hilift to get those arms straight (then redrilling the locking pin hole), and finally the license plate relocation.
 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #17
Chris and several other people pointed out that I could cure my drooping swing out arms by jacking the arms up and slightly bending the axle mounts. This I did by HiLift jacking the arms when in the nearly closed position. By going maybe a couple of clicks higher than level (and with the aid of a spirit level), I got the arms nice and level (in fact, slightly pre-loaded up so that they'd sag bag to even with load).




My problem (maybe) now is that I have somewhat extended upper hole openings for the tie pin (the lower hole remained as originally drilled). I'm concerned only about wether this will allow future sag. I'm also slightly worried about the degree of movement of the structure as a kick a$$ across the desert.




There is a gap of a little over 1/4" between the arm pieces, and I'm thinking for creating a little 2" x 3" x 1/4" steel tab to insert in here to make the fit more plush and reduce allowable movement of the swingout system relative to the vehicle.



The tab would have to fit against this lip / rim:


Anyway, I'm also interested in how much this sucker will sag under load, so I put the spare tire on. The only issue I see with the tire mount is that the lug bolts are way too long - my Gorilla lock nuts won't come close to tightening, and even the stock silver lug nuts are at full capacity a while before they can tighten. I guess I'll by some M12x1.5 regular nuts and put them on as spacers ahead of the lug nuts.








Next up is relocating the license plate, and putting the extra gas spring on the gas can arm.
 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #18
Had a chat with Chris - I'm the first one with an issue with lug bolts being too long - turns out that's due to my wheels. Check out the photo - my mounting plane is very thin. Most wheels have a much greater distance between the back of the mounting plane and the point where the lug nut contacts the wheel. A second set of open M12x1.5 lug nuts did the job.

 

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2007 Black FJC
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Discussion Starter #19
OK, so finally got the license plate on.

The plate mount itself is a trivial drill and then use of provided self taping screws.



The light needs soldering on to provided electrical cables, and then housed in conduit. The conduit is then zip-tied safely to the arm.




Since I couldn't find my tow package (no joke) behind the aux tank and all the other random [email protected] I have under the back end of the truck (the tow package is the recommended tap point for the light power), I decided just to hook it up to the power that goes to the stock license plate lights. This involved taking off the back door panel and then threading the wire into the back door. The seal on the back door conduit had already been cut once to run the CB cable from the Bandi mount, so I just ran the cable in through that.



Cables in the rear door area:


Behind the rear door panel. We ended up cutting the stock license plate lamp wires as I didn't want the now empty stock license plate mount lit. I then redirected the power to the new lamp. (As an aside: here you can see the bolt mounts for the MPAC rear door cargo panels. You can also nicely see the myriad pop-clips that help keep the rear panel on the rear door.)



All done:


Next up was the gas piston I wanted to add to the gas can side arm.

Now, there were a few mistakes here :) The piston needs 10mm ball stud mounted on the bumper/swingout base and also on the arm. The tire carrier arm came with the 10mm pre-mounted, and what I was trying to do wasn't (isn't) actually recommended. So I first started drilling the hole for the first ball stud - snapped the drill bit (will for ever have a smoothed-off drill bit in my rear bumper now, FYI) - next time, much better, got the nice clean F bit hole drilled. Then in with the tap (5/16 diameter - 18pitch is the standard size) and managed to break the tap (will forever have a smoothed off tap in my rear bumper now, FYI). Lucky me, on further detailed inspection and in doing a mechanical fit test, where I was going to put the ball stud - which was a mirror of where it is on the spare wheel arm - the mount would have limited the travel of the rear door in opening. Dumb. Third try on the drill and tap (now actually in the right place! yeay! :) ) and everything worked out. Mounting the ball joint on the arm itself is[/is] a mirror of the spare tire side, and hey-presto, a spring assisted gas can side arm:




The next thing I've been thinking about is arm movement during desert thrashing, and also pondering effects of my screwing up the initial drilling of the arm tie hole - before and after I un-sagged it. I ended up thinking that I could make the whole structure much more rigid by filling the 1/4 inch gap between the two arm pieces. Again, this isn't recommended and Chris has told me it's not necessary, but being a pig-headed jerk, I've decided to put a 1/4 inch spacer into the gap to create a solid, single arm. I may yet break the arms by doing this, so let's see how it works out when I really wheel it in the desert:






I'm going to trim the spacer to fit, JB weld the sucker in place, and paint it black to match.

OK - that's about it for the swingout!
 

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2007 Black FJC
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OK, now I think I'm done:

I shaped the aluminium spacer, and then glued it in with JB Weld.





I also used the JB Weld to fill the holes created by my drilling screw up:


And then Sunday, managed to get the Weld rattle can sprayed to match:



 
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