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As you've found, there are significant differences between the USA ("LEVII"compliant emissions control) and the AUS (not) versions of the FJ fuel tank system.

The USA filler neck has 3 tubes; 25mm fill tube, 16mm vent pipe, 6mm overflow tube. The fill tube and overflow tube are continuous hard pipe almost to the main tank. This is different than the AUS filler neck shown in the pictures, which only has 2 tubes; 35mm fill tube, 8mm vent pipe, and does not extend very far past the first bend.

This construction was the same for all years of USA, and for all years of AUS destination vehicles.

The AUS spec vehicle came with only 2 tubes, and both were a larger diameter fill and bleeder tube (as you noted, 25 -> 35mm for the fill tube, and 6 -> 8mm for the bleeder tube).

The 3rd tube (you'd called a vent pipe) is not connected to those in any way, it is an air intake for the charcoal canister, and is merely located where it is to be a snorkel, and get its air supply from up as high as possible (far from the road)). The AUS charcoal canister is located in the engine room, so has no snorkel.

These differences can cause confusion, and air leaks if not dealt with and so I sure hope Cruiser Brothers have done this installation before and can provide clear, complete instructions for what to do with US spec vehicles.
 

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Because of the very large differences between AUS and USA fuel tank systems, I am afraid that BAZ's photos may not be of much help to a US FJ.

Following what was done with an AUS vehicle too closely may make the US LEVII diagnostic system throw codes. The key will be fitting the Aux tank to the US vehicle without changing any of the systems that are currently there, in any way that will make the diagnostic system notice it is there.


N
 

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Gday,
I agree with Norm.
Our simplified system makes it very easy to build an Aux tank..and integrate it into Govt rules n regs.

In my setup, using an OE aux tank, I deliberately kept both tanks seperate....as much as possible..
KISS..

Cheers
Baz
:blueblob:
 

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Discussion Starter #44
G'Day CR,
another thing to put in the pot to ponder...
designed n build to Aussie standards ... the LRA was never meant to deal with snow/salt ..and all the northern winter nasties you get...
The exterior looks good now.... but after a year or two ...I'm worried it will be corroded and rusty..... might be worth doing something about it now...to increase the resistance to northern winters...... not sure what exactly.... por ? or something....
cheers
Baz
:blueblob:
Fortunately I live in the southeastern states, no salt/snow for me to deal with either. :bigthumb: Worst case we get 3-4 days of snow during winter, but most years we don't get any. I'm still planning to put a couple of coats of Rustoleum on it, but mostly for color and to make sure any small scratches are sealed up.
 

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Fortunately I live in the southeastern states, no salt/snow for me to deal with either. :bigthumb: Worst case we get 3-4 days of snow during winter, but most years we don't get any. I'm still planning to put a couple of coats of Rustoleum on it, but mostly for color and to make sure any small scratches are sealed up.
VB rustoleum for the win !!!!!!
:rofl::rofl:

cheers
Baz
:blueblob:
 

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Discussion Starter #46 (Edited)
1) Is this signal a pulsed signal? Izalusky mentioned in his thread (post 610) that he had measured this signal with a 10Hz pulse. The repair manual does not indicate that this signal has a waveform even though it lists several other signals with a waveform. Just need to hook up an o-scope to verify. This would be the only reason I would need a capacitor in the voltage divider circuit.
2) ******Will the APEXUS switch work with a descending voltage signal? The APEXUS programming instructions state that you can set it up to work with either an ascending or descending signal. But, after reviewing what I've found with their electrical engineer he admitted that descending voltage fuel senders like the FJ has are not very common and they haven't fully tested this function. So even if I get everything conditioned properly there is still a chance it won't work. Won't know for sure until I can do live testing, and if it doesn't I have some ideas on how to trick it using the ascending setup
A quick update on these questions from my earlier post (#27).
1) I was able to hook up an oscilloscope and test the main tank signal this afternoon and determined it is not a pulsed signal, all I'm reading is a dead steady DC voltage. So now I can finish up the connection between the main tank sender and the APEXUS switch.
2) I've traded a few more emails with the engineer at APEXUS and he says that he will be doing more testing on the descending voltage function in July. So if mine won't work properly in automatic mode he should be able to provide an update near the end of summer. Keeping my fingers crossed. Very impressed with APEXUS' responsiveness and customer service.
 

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Discussion Starter #47
The 3rd tube (you'd called a vent pipe) is not connected to those in any way, it is an air intake for the charcoal canister, and is merely located where it is to be a snorkel, and get its air supply from up as high as possible (far from the road)). The AUS charcoal canister is located in the engine room, so has no snorkel.
Thanks for this information. You and @ZerosFJ both pointed this out. It definitely looks like it is integrated into the neck, and if you look inside the neck it even looks like there are breather holes for this connection. But I got my phone in behind the neck and took a picture to confirm the 16mm pipe just connects to a plastic housing that fits around the neck. I guess the vent holes inside the neck are just to help reduce overflow.

So this indicates the 8mm line shown in the AUS filler neck is more or less equivalent to the 6mm line on the US filler neck. It is used to shut off the filler nozzle by piping fuel up to the neck as soon as the tank is full. This makes the plumbing make more sense, but I still don't have the right fittings, hosing, or reducers for this to mate correctly to a US spec vehicle.
I've sent CruiserBrothers what I'm thinking, hopefully they'll confirm and send me the correct hardware quickly so I don't have to buy it myself.
 

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Don't think VB would work, it would give my truck a black and blue butt! :rofl:
Think I'll stick with black and maybe and orange stripe or two!
:rofl::rofl: nought wrong with a blue butt !!!!!
but orange might work....
:rofl:

cheers
Baz
:blueblob:
 

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Discussion Starter #51
Also pulled out the OEM filler neck. The barbed ends on the tubes is the reason they want you to cut-off and re-use the ends. Still going to make my own though.

I didn't get a picture of it, but the small tube is a little difficult to get loose. The barb of the tube is held in place by a blue, plastic, push-in locking collar. The only way I could figure out how to get it loose was to open the collar until it came out of the fitting. I wouldn't do this when it was cold, you'd probably snap the plastic.

You can see the charcoal canister snorkel on the filler end of the neck. There's no way to adapt this to the LRA neck so I'll have to figure out something else to do here.

.
 

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Don't think VB would work, it would give my truck a black and blue butt! :rofl:
Think I'll stick with black and maybe and orange stripe or two!
:wink
 

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"There's no way to adapt this to the LRA neck so I'll have to figure out something else to do here. "

Proposal: have a muffler shop (or anyone skilled with welding tubing together) modify your original neck to be split the way the LRA neck is, and then flare the end of the tube going to the AUX tank out to fit the much larger diameter LRA tank's input. Might be simpler and more straightforward than trying to modify everything else to fit the incompatible LRA version.

Since LRA markets this as a special "export" tank, and it is described on their website as "suited for NA market", that would imply that they would have solved those very clear differences before shipping it to you. This is making me wonder what the guys at Cruiser Brothers have to say about this. Haven't they installed one before you? If so, they must have already realized these things and have a plan for how to deal with it.

For as much money as the tank costs, and with how its described on the website I'd expect the parts to have been made to fit.


N
 

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Discussion Starter #54
"...For as much money as the tank costs, and with how its described on the website I'd expect the parts to have been made to fit."

This has been the main cause of any frustration I've had with this tank install, the kit was not complete for a US spec vehicle and the instructions were very incomplete. In the end though, the problems have all been fittings and tubing, nothing insurmountable or expensive to fix, just wish it had come with the right parts to start with.

CruiserBrothers sent me an email today letting me know that LRA has confirmed that they didn't make any changes to the fitment kit for the US, but will be updating it now that they know there is a problem. Not sure how long that will take (or why they didn't do their homework to start with), but I would imagine it will be several months before the tanks are delivered correctly from LRA. I also learned that I have the first US spec tank (at least the first one sold through CruiserBrothers). Credit where credit is due CB has apologized for the issues, provided technical support based on their LC200 installs, and have been generous with their offer to take care of expenses I've incurred. So, they are standing behind their product which I appreciate.
 

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Discussion Starter #55
Filler neck fitment.....1 - Tubing

One of my main goals was not to cut my OEM filler tubing per the LRA instructions (item #2 ). So I'm deviating from the LRA instructions here. I spent a good portion of this weekend fitting and refitting the filler parts to get the tubing and adaptor routing and sizing figured out to where I was happy with it. In the end I modified 3 portions of the LRA kit; 1) the main tank rollover valve tube, 2) the main tank filler tube, and 3) the aux tank filler tube.

1) Main tank rollover tube. To recreate the barbed end of the small 6mm tube I started with a short piece of 1/4" stainless tubing and installed a brass compression collar 25mm from one end. These are the same collars you see in fittings from household plumbing. I actually hollowed out a plumbing fitting, so I could insert the tube far enough, and used it to compress the collar into place. The purpose of this collar is to prevent the tube from backing out of the coupling on the tank. It's hard to see in the picture, but I also rounded the end of the tube closest to the collar. This tube inserts into a coupling with an o-ring, the rounded end will help prevent the o-ring from getting damaged. Then I added 1/4" fuel hose back to the neck and replaced the fitting at the LRA neck with 1/4" barbed fitting.

2) Main tank filler tube. No magic here. I cut an 8" (200mm) piece of 1" (25.4mm) stainless tube to substitute for the original 25mm tube. Then deburred the ends to prevent damage to the rubber tubes. I added a 1-1/4"-to-1" hose ID reducer to the end of the 1" stainless tube and then used a hose clamp to secure 1-3/8" fuel line on top of that. I couldn't find a 1-3/8"-to-1" ID reducer but the rubber hose has plenty of flex to securely crush down to 1-1/4". The 1-3/8" fuel hose then runs back to the 35mm LRA filler neck.

3) Aux tank filler neck. The kit comes with a 140mm x 35mm section of hose to connect the filler neck to the aux tank. However, I have a 1/2" Bandi body lift on my truck, so anything mounted on the body (ie filler neck) is now 1/2" further away from anything mounted on the frame (ie aux tank). This was enough of a difference to where I was concerned about the amount of engagement with the hose. So I cut a new section of 160mm x 1-3/8" fuel hose to compensate.

Finally, here is the full hose kit I came up with, minus 2 hoses that are installed on the aux tank.
 

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Filler neck fitment.....1 - Tubing

One of my main goals was not to cut my OEM filler tubing per the LRA instructions (item #2 ). So I'm deviating from the LRA instructions here. I spent a good portion of this weekend fitting and refitting the filler parts to get the tubing and adaptor routing and sizing figured out to where I was happy with it. In the end I modified 3 portions of the LRA kit; 1) the main tank rollover valve tube, 2) the main tank filler tube, and 3) the aux tank filler tube.

1) Main tank rollover tube. To recreate the barbed end of the small 6mm tube I started with a short piece of 1/4" stainless tubing and installed a brass compression collar 25mm from one end. These are the same collars you see in fittings from household plumbing. I actually hollowed out a plumbing fitting, so I could insert the tube far enough, and used it to compress the collar into place. The purpose of this collar is to prevent the tube from backing out of the coupling on the tank. It's hard to see in the picture, but I also rounded the end of the tube closest to the collar. This tube inserts into a coupling with an o-ring, the rounded end will help prevent the o-ring from getting damaged. Then I added 1/4" fuel hose back to the neck and replaced the fitting at the LRA neck with 1/4" barbed fitting.

2) Main tank filler tube. No magic here. I cut an 8" (200mm) piece of 1" (25.4mm) stainless tube to substitute for the original 25mm tube. Then deburred the ends to prevent damage to the rubber tubes. I added a 1-1/4"-to-1" hose ID reducer to the end of the 1" stainless tube and then used a hose clamp to secure 1-3/8" fuel line on top of that. I couldn't find a 1-3/8"-to-1" ID reducer but the rubber hose has plenty of flex to securely crush down to 1-1/4". The 1-3/8" fuel hose then runs back to the 35mm LRA filler neck.

3) Aux tank filler neck. The kit comes with a 140mm x 35mm section of hose to connect the filler neck to the aux tank. However, I have a 1/2" Bandi body lift on my truck, so anything mounted on the body (ie filler neck) is now 1/2" further away from anything mounted on the frame (ie aux tank). This was enough of a difference to where I was concerned about the amount of engagement with the hose. So I cut a new section of 160mm x 1-3/8" fuel hose to compensate.

Finally, here is the full hose kit I came up with, minus 2 hoses that are installed on the aux tank.
Great Work mate....
shame LRA ..dropped the ball ..on this ..
But your solution will work perfectly....

Cheers
Baz
:blueblob:
 

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Discussion Starter #57
Filler neck fitment.....2 - tube mounts.

On the end of the OEM filler assembly there is a mounting bracket that holds the tubes securely to the underside of the body. Close to this, there is also a plastic clip that holds one of the charcoal canister tubes in place near the filler tubes. I tied the charcoal canister line to a wire loom just above it to keep it out of the way and then reused the 2 clips to securely mount the 2 new sections of stainless tubing to the underside of the body. I had to reverse the location of the mounting bracket to compensate for the new angle of the tubing which is why I had to reuse the plastic clip to hold the 6mm tube. The hoses then have a gentle arc over to the filler neck (I thought I took a final picture of this, but I didn't sorry).
 

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Discussion Starter #58
Great Work mate....
shame LRA ..dropped the ball ..on this ..
But your solution will work perfectly....

Cheers
Baz
:blueblob:
Thanks! and no worries, except for the inconvenience, sometimes its more fun when the solution isn't handed to you on a silver platter. I'm definitely learning more about the fuel system than I normally would have if it had been plug and play.
 

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Really appreciate your pictures and thorough descriptions. :cheers:

Watching to see how cruiser brothers handle the situation. :popblood:
 

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My understanding of the 'NA spec' was that the only difference was they altered the tank shape to accommodate the charcoal canister... looks like that's about all they did.

I'm so glad you're doing this not me!
 
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