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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was looking at the installation instructions for the new TRD CAI(PTR03-35090) and the instructions specifically mention "On Super Charged applications" on page 12!! This indicates that the new TRD CAI is compatible with supercharger installs and will not void your supercharger warranty, as specified in the "TRD Supercharger Warranty Certificate. :bigthumb: :clap: :rocker:

So, what is the general opinion of the new TRD CAI?

[EDIT] Found some reviews here. Doesn't look good. The new CAI apparently causes the engine to run super lean because of a "significant induced MAF Sensor error". :( :flame: :rocket:
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/engine-performance/107218-new-trd-cai-ptr03-35090-a.html
1GR Intake Comparisons.... (xr-underground.com)


 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
From xr-underground.com. Gadget posted this(note highlighted text):
Test vehicle, 2007 FJ Crusier 20,200 miles, manual trans, Permanent AWD, completely stock

1GR intake comparison

New TRD
FT idle +17.47 +19.24
FT 60 MPH +16.28 +18.58
AFR WOT Max RPM 12.8

aFe Stage 2 Si
FT idle +5.32 +6.28
FT 60 MPH +4.63 +5.73
AFR WOT Max RPM 10.5

Stock
FT idle +4.75 +5.25
FT 60 MPH +4.85 +5.15
AFR WOT Max RPM 10.7

So far the new TRD version shows a significant induced MAF Sensor error.

Did some dyno runs today in completely stock configuration and will post that data when I get some time to compile it. I am going to attempt to get another dyno session in with the X-1 installed before the URD Supercharger system is installed.

MTF....

G

.....

Yes, I have dynos with the stock, aFe (same as old TRD), and the new TRD.

Off the top of my head the aFe made around +12 RWHP.

I have to go speed install and X-1...

I will explain the data later. Going to be super busy the next few days. First impression, supercharged folks might need to be very careful running the new TRD. It appears to make things run super lean. I would like to get a couple more data points to see if that is the norm or the one I have has some kind of production anomaly. Anyone going to be a the VA Beach meet with one??

I will likely have a new style TRD intake for sale discounted very soon if anyone is interested.

G
A post by another knowledgeable member(gtmoy):
New TRD
FT idle +17.47 +19.24
FT 60 MPH +16.28 +18.58

Assuming the 1st # is ST and 2nd is LT

Those are fuel trims. The ECU learns and adjusts for day to day driving conditions at different load points. So @ idle, the ECU is shooting for 14.7 AFR and it's base map puts in a predetermined amount of fuel, then based on the AFR from the Wraf sensor it adds or subtracts fuel to reach 14.7

Short term fuel trim compensates for short transitory AFR differences, however if a trend occurs (constant fuel trim) the ECU changes the long term trim, which essentially changes the base map and now at that load point the default fuel is base + LT, then look at AFR and +/- ST

Same for 60MPH load point.

In the case of the TRD, it looks like it is causing the MAF to show less air is entering the engine, lowering the perceived load.
So now at idle instead of being at say 20% load it's at 10% and injects correspondingly less fuel, then the AFR shows a lean condition and ST/LT FTs compensate, it looks like almost ~35% more fuel.

The case of the AFR @ WOT, the stock ECU is going open loop and ignoring the Wraf and instead basing fuel injection on load alone and the open loop map. Same problem, the TRD intake shows less air and so the ECU is feeding less fuel than needed for the amount of air coming in.
 

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Quick question:

If it was running lean, wouldn't the 02 sensors pick up on this immediately and adjust accordingly? Or is that just ideal thinking?

Also, i wonder what random hoop they had to jump through in order to make this one legal in Cali. I have no idea how changing the filtration element to flat instead of conical made it CARB legal. The intake tube is basically the same, and the intake box is still an intake box.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
According to what gtmoy wrote, the ECU can only adjust for "short transitory AFR differences". But when a trend occurs, a "constant fuel trim" in this case, the ECU changes the LT trim and that is when things go bad. (Yeh, still trying to wrap my head around this AFR stuff. :lol:)

To make it CARB legal all you need to have is a charcoal filter, which is in the top of the cap(I posted a pic above). Our stock intakes have this filter too I believe.

Quick question:

If it was running lean, wouldn't the 02 sensors pick up on this immediately and adjust accordingly? Or is that just ideal thinking?

Also, i wonder what random hoop they had to jump through in order to make this one legal in Cali. I have no idea how changing the filtration element to flat instead of conical made it CARB legal. The intake tube is basically the same, and the intake box is still an intake box.
 

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Kay, that makes sense on the CARB change. That is the "secondary" filter on the stock intake i assume you are referring to.

I wonder why if this is an issue with the supercharger why it is not an issue with the stock engine with the TRD CAI.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Yes, I think most people here refer to the charcoal filter as the "secondary" filter.

I would have to assume that it IS an issue with N/A engines too, but might not effect them as bad because of the "limited" amount of air being pulled through(no SC).

Kay, that makes sense on the CARB change. That is the "secondary" filter on the stock intake i assume you are referring to.

I wonder why if this is an issue with the supercharger why it is not an issue with the stock engine with the TRD CAI.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Got this response from Gadget @ xr-underground when I asked if the new TRD CAI still had issues. Basically, stay away from the new TRD intake. :(
IT seems the problem still exists. I get calls a couple times a week from dealer mechanics that install the NEW TRD intake with supercharger systems and get all kinds of problems from it. Lean codes and so on.

They take it off and put the stock air filter box back on and the problems go away.

Anyway, based on my own experience and all the different reports I get on it, I would stay away from the new TRD intake. The old one works fine and so does the current aFe Stage 2si intake with the TRD supercharger.

For those of you that do not know, the new TRD is made by K&N.

G
 

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Hmm, that is kind of sucky TRD outsourced to K&N

I wonder if you could add just an extra filtration element, or something along those lines to reduce the air flow slightly so that it would prevent the lean codes?

Also, i have ran the old style TRD intake with my supercharger for 22K miles and never once had an engine code or issue on my scangauge.
 

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Its kind of strange they would approve the new one that may run lean and they wouldn't approve the old TRD that worked.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Its kind of strange they would approve the new one that may run lean and they wouldn't approve the old TRD that worked.
From what I understand the 1st gen TRD worked fine with the TRD SC, it just wasn't CARB approved. :(
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
How easy is it to swap in/out the CAI and the stock intake?

I was thinking about getting the aFe Stage 2si and then just swapping back in the stock intake if I need to go in for warranty work.
 

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How easy is it to swap in/out the CAI and the stock intake?

I was thinking about getting the aFe Stage 2si and then just swapping back in the stock intake if I need to go in for warranty work.
It is really easy. Takes less than 15 minutes. I originally sold my first TRD intake when I had the supercharger installed for warranty purposes and then I wanted dual batteries and didn't have the room with the stock. So, I bought my second one when I did the battery install. I have saved my stock one in case I have to do emissions. Still running the old school TRD and even added a snorkel to it. The AFE is basically the same but it has a port in front that can be sealed up easily.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I was thinking the swap out should be pretty easy. Good point about emissions, I'll have to do that too.

Seems like the 1st gen TRD is hard to find now. True? So might as well just go with the aFe then.
 

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Very simple to swap them out if you need to do so for emissions testing. Maybe 20 minutes? Tops.

The only difference between the TRD and AFE besides color is that the AFE has a hole on the bottom of the box you need to plug up to not be pulling hot engine air.
 

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AFE:



TRD:



I didn't like the blingy silver so i painted the top black on mine. Looks much better.
 

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This is mine but I want to do a clear cover on top of the intake.

The AFE is basically the same thing.
 
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