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· Catalyst
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
As I was reading through the list of OHV project grant requests for this year at the Colorado State Parks office website, one of them struck me as a bit odd.....or maybe just disappointing.

Specifically, it's project number 22 - "Poughkeepsie Gulch Public Safety Project" on this PDF
http://www.parks.state.co.us/SiteCo...HV Grant Application Project Descriptions.pdf


This project aims to create a by-pass for the 'Winch-Wall', stated like this...
"an alternate route for inexperienced drivers and stock vehicles to go around this technically challenging Obstacle"


Now, don't get me wrong, I have totally appreciated when there have been bypasses on trails that we've done in the past when Sandi wasn't ready for the big obstacles yet or whatever, but with this particular trail, it doesn't seem right for some reason.

It's the only trail in the entire Ouray area that is really, actually technically challenging to the point where you have to be extremely careful and pick your line properly, and/or maybe even have to winch up it like when it's wet from rain or snow-melt.

There's just something cool for most of us off-roaders about being able to take that trail all the way, and have a sense of accomplishment. Ya, I know ...it's still pretty mild compared to the really crazy stuff available to the West in the Moab area or even up north in the Montrose area, but for this area, it's all we have in that category.


I'm sure there are valid reasons to create the by-pass though....and I won't 'fight' it in any sense. It just seems disappointing....like we're losing something. I guess what we're gaining though is the chance for the less experienced among us to go along on the trail run and watch.

Perhaps the 'public safety' aspect of it is for the sake of all of the people that take off on that trail not knowing what it's really like, and decide to 'go for it' when they get to the winch-wall in spite of the fact that neither they nor their vehicle is up to the task (I can totally understand wanting to avoid that kind of scenario).

I'd just rather see them spend some of the money on some great signage to warn people of how difficult the trail really is and to ward off the inexperienced and unsuspecting folks. They could even build up a 'guardian' (an entrance obstacle of sorts) at both ends to make sure people turn around when they see how difficult it is just to get on the trail in the first place.

Oh well, like I said above, if the project gets funded and goes through, I won't fight it. At least I had a few chances before the by-pass went in.


One thing I'd wonder though is, will it be closed off completely during this construction period?
Also, it doesn't actually mention when they plan on doing this project, but I assume that, since it usually doesn't even open up from the snow until sometime in July, it would most likely take place right when most of us would normally be heading that way (for Summit or some other vacation).


Uh-oh....
As it turns out, I guess I'm kind of dense when it comes to reading through official documentation like this... From the following excerpt, it sounds like Poughkeepsie Gulch is currently officially closed till further notice, and this project is the only way it's going to reopen anyway...

"San Juan County has identified areas, at the beginning of road and at the end of the road, which
will need some reconstruction. This is what will be required to reopen County Road 58A for public access
the following is a breakdown of the estimated costs.

Poughkeepsie Gulch Road Bypass (For Wall Area) and Public Safety Project
This is a breakdown of the estimated costs and hours and equipment needed to perform this
construction road work project on San Juan County road #58A Pouqhkeepsie Gulch."

....is that how you guys read this?
 

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I believe that the closure (58A) is actually the bypass, not the whole trail. There was previously a bypass at the winch wall and it was closed off a number of years ago. This sounds like an effort to re-open the bypass and probably doesn't affect the rest of the trail. :bigthumb:
 

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It better be open during summit because I've been looking forward to it since I had to pass up Summit last year.

Just sayin! :ninja:
 

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I'd guess it may partially have to do with trail repairs needed on the section just before the wall that was badly washed out sometime before the Summit last year.

There was a large sign "for expert drivers only" near the entrance, but I don't recall seeing it there last year.

I do wish they would replace the missing winch anchor that was about 30 ft above the wall.


Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app
 

· Catalyst
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
...does mean they wont reopen it until this has been completed? that would suck, the bypass would suck, this could just be all around sucky.
:lol:

I believe that the closure (58A) is actually the bypass, not the whole trail. There was previously a bypass at the winch wall and it was closed off a number of years ago. This sounds like an effort to re-open the bypass and probably doesn't affect the rest of the trail. :bigthumb:
Thanks, Jess. I forgot how they do the road naming. I was going on the idea that the first, main road is 'A', but I think the first, main road is just the number, and then any offshoots are lettered. So, you're probably correct, and this 58A is not the same as 58 (which is the official number for Poughkeepsie Gulch).

When I read it at first, I only made mental note of this part...

"This is a breakdown of the estimated costs and hours and equipment needed to perform this construction road work project on San Juan County road #58A Pouqhkeepsie Gulch."

...which seems to equate 58A with Poughkeepsie Gulch.

Then, after you brought this up, I went back and noticed this part earlier...

"The Bypass Route is County Road 58A, will provide an alternate route for inexperienced drivers and stock vehicles to go around this technically challenging Obstacle"

So, with that in mind, I guess that when it says,
"This is what will be required to reopen County Road 58A for public access"

...it's just talking about the by-pass, and not the whole road we know and love as Poughkeepsie Gulch.


As for how bad it will suck to have a by-pass at the winch wall.... I suppose one way to look at it is that, if people are going to drive up this trail, knowing that they will take the by-pass, just to sit around for a while watching others like us go up the wall, it's not all bad.

It better be open during summit because I've been looking forward to it since I had to pass up Summit last year.

Just sayin! :ninja:
I know exactly what you mean....that's what I'm hoping as well.

Too bad it's not the kind of project that average folks could do, cause I bet if it were, we'd be able to get a good sized crew up there to help with it to make sure it gets done in time.

I'd guess it may partially have to do with trail repairs needed on the section just before the wall that was badly washed out sometime before the Summit last year....
Ya, that was the first time I've ever seen that spot like that. I think it actually added a really nice extra obstacle to the mix. If there's a way to shore it up so that it's not continuing to destroy the surrounding vegitation, and manage to let the obstacle stay there, that would be great.

...There was a large sign "for expert drivers only" near the entrance, but I don't recall seeing it there last year.
I'm not sure how large you mean, but there were indeed signs with those words on them at both ends of the trail when we went through during Summit last year.

[Image from TitaniumTonka in his thread about our Friday morning run last year]


...I do wish they would replace the missing winch anchor that was about 30 ft above the wall.
I may be mistaken, but I think both of the anchor points that I recall from years past were available when we went through on Friday morning.

We didn't need them this time though....so, who knows?...perhaps I missed the fact that one or more was/were missing simply because I didn't need them at all.

I did help a couple top-heavy rigs up by pulling a bit with a strap to get them up, but nobody in our group had to winch that time, cause it was dry enough.

Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app
^^^^ seems a bit fancy for you :lol:

j/k my good buddy :bigthumb:


we can all try the first wall, if they screw up the big one. My goal is to climb the first one this year. It will happen. :lol:
Ha ha, I want to see it happen. :rocker: Let's hope we have a good spell of dry weather right around Summit time this year so there isn't so much moisture sitting around to have to deal with.
 

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Thanks, Jess. I forgot how they do the road naming.
Your username is OCR14A and you forget how they do naming?!? :rofl::rofl:

I'm up for trying the first wall this year! Hopefully my FJ will actually be capable enough to make it too. :lol: The fact that no FJC has been known to make it up that one yet is a little discouraging though...
 

· Catalyst
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Your username is OCR14A and you forget how they do naming?!? :rofl::rofl:
Ya....well....there is that :lol:


...I'm up for trying the first wall this year! Hopefully my FJ will actually be capable enough to make it too. :lol: The fact that no FJC has been known to make it up that one yet is a little discouraging though...
At the Summit in 2009, I saw the All-Pro FJC on 42s not be able to get up it. So, it's highly unlikely that it will be anywhere near possible for yours unless either it or the obstacle has been extremely modified by the time we get there.

Still, if you 'try', I will record the video. :cheers:
 
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