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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Like a lot of people, I never really liked that the vent on the FJ's hood was fake. And considering the position of the CAI in the fender well, it wouldn't do much good even if it were real. So the snorkel got me to thinking...
By no means is the pic to any kind of scale, but you get the general idea. Nice cool air being forced into the filter box.
Now right off the bat, I know there needs to be a filter under the grill and this isn't for people who submerge their FJ's in water every weekend. But what do you think?
 

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I am kind of lost on your drawing. Is that suppose to be a side shot of the passenger fender? And have that be a sort of mini snorkel sticking out of the fenderwell?
 

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The standard OEM air pickup is already in the fenderwell in the same area and draws air from outside the engine compartment. How does this item improve on that?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Yes is in the same outside location of the snorkel. The shot is supposed to depict a small scoop facing forward, mounted above the passenger side wheel well which feeds directly into the airbox via a 3" diameter tube (give or take).
I understand the air is already being drawn from the outside. I think this idea, with the extended scoop facing forward would actually further cool and force air into the box. Am I an engineer? Nope. Do I have anything to support this? Nope. Just thinking out loud and taking a look at ideas I've seen on other car applications such as ram airs being placed under fenders, etc.
 

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Kind of a "short snorkel" essentially, right?
 

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I was talking with someone else about this. It's actually a good Idea if you don't plan to do water crossings. It should keep the filter cleaner and cooler air also. I like it.
 

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Yes is in the same outside location of the snorkel. The shot is supposed to depict a small scoop facing forward, mounted above the passenger side wheel well which feeds directly into the airbox via a 3" diameter tube (give or take).
I understand the air is already being drawn from the outside. I think this idea, with the extended scoop facing forward would actually further cool and force air into the box. Am I an engineer? Nope. Do I have anything to support this? Nope. Just thinking out loud and taking a look at ideas I've seen on other car applications such as ram airs being placed under fenders, etc.
I think I get it now... and this would raise the intake by a couple of inches too. But you're still left with no choice but to cut a hole in the fender and if your going to do that, why not install a snorkel? Just thinking out loud.
 

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Correct this might give you more air. However, in heavy rain or water crossings, this will almost always fill your intake with water. Especially if it is a scoop.

I think i remember seeing something like this that came out of the hood on old school willy's jeeps. It was like just an airfilter that sat on top of the hood. I just looked for pictures but couldn't find anything.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Kind of a "short snorkel" essentially, right?
Yeah I guess it can be thought of that way. It's funny because you guys are obviously hardcore wheelers, and I hit the occasional trail and do a lot of highway driving.

Why not do the snorkel? Like I said, if you don't go waste deep in water all the time, that's a pretty big piece of equipment to put on the rig (it does look cool, don't get me wrong!), and it seems to me, the shorter the run, the more forced cold air you'll get.

And this was just an idea off the top of my head with the air box where it is. Essentially this could be moved to the hood, just like the old muscle cars.
And for water (such as rain), I've seen covers that still allow air to get in, but keep moisture out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I was talking with someone else about this. It's actually a good Idea if you don't plan to do water crossings. It should keep the filter cleaner and cooler air also. I like it.
Why thank ya sir. I know some guys that do injection molding. I wonder what material would be best for this. Like an ABS?
 

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Your not going to gain anything by this, but make the breather more easy to get water and debrie inside the air box, every mud puddle, etc. If your going to put a large hole on the side of the fender, it makes allot more sense to run the snorkel, I get about 3 degrees over ambient air intake to the engine by running the snorkel into my CAI. Sorry, but it's a bad idea IMHO. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
It's ok I expect blanket statements like that. And heck, for the small amount I know you could be right. I'm sure years ago there were posts about snorkels being a bad idea too, so who knows. Besides, the snorkel surface area for the opening seems a little small, is way to long and has too many turns to be effective for this.

I do know in the models like I've seen (I'm not coming up with a new concept here, just new to the FJ), there are filters behind the scoop, in fact making it harder for debris to get into the air box.
As for no gains, I don't agree. I have a gut feeling you'd see power gains commensurate to how fast you're driving... Up to a certain point of course. Air blasting directly into the air box has to have more of an effect that randomly finding it's way in from the wheel well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I did a lot of research on hood scoops this past week. Here's what I found:

The placement of the inlet is extremely important. This is why most cold air rams are placed under the bumper or in the front grill; its an area of high air flow around a vehicle. With the snorkel waving way up high over the truck, some air will obviously get in there, but it's so far away from the truck that it's in an area of low air resistance. That and the distance is so far away from the air box as I mentioned before.

Hood Scoops on older muscle cars were sometimes considered ineffective not only because of the placement, but also because the air filters were open to the engine bay. The air was not only hot by the time it got through the filter, but it wasn't going directly in either. Having a sealed air box seems would overcome this problem and lower temperatures while forcing more air through the system.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
Ok, moving in a different direction. Can anyone verify that the Tacoma has the same or similar hood? Check this out:
Volant Ram Intake Scoop | Toyota Tacoma 2004-2007 | Ram Scoop 38640

"If you want to further increase your Volant Cool Air Intake’s effectiveness, add on the Volant Performance Air Scoop. Customers using the Volant Cool Air Intake with the scoop report 2-4 MPG improvements in fuel economy, as well as dyno-proven horsepower and torque increases. Volant is the only air intake company to properly apply a functioning Ram-Air Scoop to a sealed air intake box. The scoops fit without any modifications and are formed to match each vehicle and attach to a high air-pressure point behind the bumper or near the vehicle’s front valance to take in nothing but cold air. The Volant Ram Air Scoops are made from the same heavy-duty, durable x-link polyethylene plastic as the intake systems and are simple to install and feature baffles &/or drain holes to prevent the injection of water into the intake. These Performance Air Scoops are a great way to upgrade your existing Volant cold air intake system (which is sold seperately) to add dramatic increases in performance as well as fuel economy! The Volant Performance Air Scoops come with a 1 year warranty." Quote from an a Voland ad I saw online.

This looks very promising. Volant makes an aftermarket air box that has an entry point for the scoop. I would think a careful mod any of our CAI boxes could yield the same results. Thoughts???
 

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Ok, moving in a different direction. Can anyone verify that the Tacoma has the same or similar hood? Check this out:
Volant Ram Intake Scoop | Toyota Tacoma 2004-2007 | Ram Scoop 38640

If you want to further increase your Volant Cool Air Intake’s effectiveness, add on the Volant Performance Air Scoop. Customers using the Volant Cool Air Intake with the scoop report 2-4 MPG improvements in fuel economy, as well as dyno-proven horsepower and torque increases. Volant is the only air intake company to properly apply a functioning Ram-Air Scoop to a sealed air intake box. The scoops fit without any modifications and are formed to match each vehicle and attach to a high air-pressure point behind the bumper or near the vehicle’s front valance to take in nothing but cold air. The Volant Ram Air Scoops are made from the same heavy-duty, durable x-link polyethylene plastic as the intake systems and are simple to install and feature baffles &/or drain holes to prevent the injection of water into the intake. These Performance Air Scoops are a great way to upgrade your existing Volant cold air intake system (which is sold seperately) to add dramatic increases in performance as well as fuel economy! The Volant Performance Air Scoops come with a 1 year warranty.

This looks very promising. Volant makes an aftermarket air box that has an entry point for the scoop. I would think a careful mod any of our CAI boxes could yield the same results. Thoughts???
A lot of poor information in the above statement (which appears to be a straight advertising statement versus an original post - should quote the source). First, the FJC has a completely different hood than the Tacoma. Second, the reason Toyota (and many other companies) pulls the air in from the side of the vehicle is that it avoids using pre-heated air flowing over the front of the car, where the radiator is. And the snorkel works the same (actually, better, IMO) as the scoop, extracting the cooler, cleaner air rather than the warmer, dirtier air at the front of the vehicle at hood level. And that "scoop" would spell disaster in a deep water crossing, if you were to find yourself in that situation.
 

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Did you get a chance to look at the Volant filter posted by Felonious and Air2air?

This is Air2air's on 11/06/07
 

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I do know in the models like I've seen (I'm not coming up with a new concept here, just new to the FJ), there are filters behind the scoop, in fact making it harder for debris to get into the air box.
As for no gains, I don't agree. I have a gut feeling you'd see power gains commensurate to how fast you're driving... Up to a certain point of course. Air blasting directly into the air box has to have more of an effect that randomly finding it's way in from the wheel well.
Again, this is not about "GUT" feelings. I run a Scan Gauge II, I monitored intake air "BEFORE" installing a TRD CAI. I was getting with a stock breather setup anywhere from 26 to 30 degrees over ambient air intake. I installed my CAI and ambient air dropped a min of 20-25 Degrees once I installed a CAI. I then installed a Snorkel and the intake air droped another 6 degrees in air temps, now running 3 degrees over ambient. By having the intake at a higher level, insures that the engine only recieves cold air. :)

PS. I'm not bashing you, I think it's great your thinking outside the box so to speak. I just want to point out, that allot of members have a lot of "REAL WORLD" info on here that helps when trying to figure out something new. Check out the tech section. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Hi guys thanks for all your input. I completely understand and respect the technical side of things and having real world numbers to back it up. Absolutely no question.

Yes, the statement above was straight from a Volant advertisement (I thought that was obvious, but anyway). They state that they have either a filter or proper drainage in place that would take care of water issues. Again not submerging the truck! I didn't realize the number of people on here that use their FJ as a submarine (I'm saying that with humor, relax). At any rate, the above product I think would be the perfect complement to the fender port.

About the snorkel- I didn't say the snorkel doesn't cool air going into the intake, so please don't infer I did. What I am saying is that a shorter more direct scoop with a larger surface area will do that more effiecently. If you need me to build one to justify my gut feeling, I just may. :)

And yes Air's filter layout is pretty cool and he's received a lot of praise for that. In my opinion if the cone was seaeled and only let air in from the hood vent, that would be much more effective. But he's got so much power coming from his supercharger, pulley and probably different gearing, it doesn't matter anyway.

And as for the Tacoma's I wonder how different the placement of the hood vent is. It seems it should be somewhat close to do a little modification to the tubing might not be so bad. And if you guys have time, take a look at FJoel's thread on the Volant intake from the Tacoma. You'll notice it has two ports on their aftermarket air box which makes total sense seeing that you'd get cold air coming from the fender and more air coming from the hood vent. I've read from a lot of Tacoma owners that adding an extra inlet inside the engine bay was the way to go. Its supposed to be a common mod on their stock air box as well.

I'm going to do some research during the day and see what Volant has to say about water and fitting this on an FJ.

Thanks everyone!
 
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