I have put a deposit down on an FJ. Now I have found the exact FJ that I want at a different dealer, that is available for delivery next week. I'd like to get that deposit back to purchase this one that is immediately available, rather than wait 90 days for the same vehicle at my original dealer. When I put down the deposit they said the deposit was not refundable. Is that legal?

If you contracted for a specific vehicle, and they ordered a specific vehicle for you; it could be. It's called "consideration".

If you drove down the street and saw a house for sale and gave the current owner "earnest money" to hold the house for you.......would you expect him to pass over the next 3 offers (thinking and telling them "it's sold") without keeping your deposit??

I'm deeply interested in you answer.

 

If you signed a order with them, you signed a contract. But there are some "interpretations" that can assist you. I just went through the same thing. The original dealer wanted to know if I bought the FJ somewhere else. I refused to discuss anything outside of my order with them. If you admit that you bought somewhere else, you basically violated the contract and are still bound by it. On the other hand, if you request that they cancel the order because of things like they didn't find the vehicle in the time frame initially agreed, or they did not find the exact vehicle ordered, they may be cool and refund your deposit. The good dealers will say something like - sorry we could not serve you this time but we hope you will be a customer in future. My dealer got really nasty with me - I cancelled after 5 weeks because I found one in 3 in 4 hours. But I got the deposit back. Another option if they do not want to refund the deposit is to request that you can apply it to parts or service in future. Hope this helps. Good luck !

 

If you contracted for a specific vehicle, and they ordered a specific vehicle for you; it could be. It's called "consideration".

If you drove down the street and saw a house for sale and gave the current owner "earnest money" to hold the house for you.......would you expect him to pass over the next 3 offers (thinking and telling them "it's sold") without keeping your deposit??

I'm deeply interested in you answer.

Belo,

May or may not be legal depends on what you have in writing and your local laws. Check with Your states Attorney General.

Rover, Your house thing, you are not comparing Apples to Apples. On an order the dealer cannot really sell the truck until it hits the lot. No one is coming by and passing on it cause it is not at the dealer for sale. If the guy passes on the order, when to truck comes in they will be able to sell it to the next guy.

Now if they stated NON REFUNDABLE up front on his deal and he knew that going in. The stand up thing to do would be to honor that.

 

Belo,

May or may not be legal depends on what you have in writing and your local laws. Check with Your states Attorney General.

Rover, Your house thing, you are not comparing Apples to Apples. On an order the dealer cannot really sell the truck until it hits the lot. No one is coming by and passing on it cause it is not at the dealer for sale. If the guy passes on the order, when to truck comes in they will be able to sell it to the next guy.

Now if they stated NON REFUNDABLE up front on his deal and he knew that going in. The stand up thing to do would be to honor that.

I think the point of commitment is when the dealer finds the vehicle and the custoemr accepts it. Chances are they will find something close, but the customer has to decide if he/she wants to accept it. At that point, I think the customer and dealer are bound to fulfilling the order. But where did the 90 days come from ? Did the dealer actually find one that you accepted and the estimated delivery was 90 days ? If so, you should be bound to the deposit. But if the dealer has nothing and is just guessing 90 days, you should be able to cancel the order with no harm done to the dealer.

 

Most dealers will refund the deposit, if yours does not I would contact every salesmanager at the dealership and complain. With enough phonecalls the dealer will be sick of hearing from you and refund the deposit. Good luck!

 

Another thought - my dealer didn't respond to my request for a refund until I sent the request in writing to them - return receipt. I think they were trying to 1) stop me from buying somewhere else, 2) scramble to find the vehicle and 3) hope I would back down.

 

I think the point of commitment is when the dealer finds the vehicle and the custoemr accepts it. Chances are they will find something close, but the customer has to decide if he/she wants to accept it. At that point, I think the customer and dealer are bound to fulfilling the order. But where did the 90 days come from ? Did the dealer actually find one that you accepted and the estimated delivery was 90 days ? If so, you should be bound to the deposit. But if the dealer has nothing and is just guessing 90 days, you should be able to cancel the order with no harm done to the dealer.

I would agree with you. I had more than one deposit for orders at different dealers. But I had in writing that the deposits were Refundable. And I told them that I will be buying the first truck that came in with the correct options. I also made Dep. by credit card. If no product was recieved the CC company will refund the charges.

 

Belo,

May or may not be legal depends on what you have in writing and your local laws. Check with Your states Attorney General.

Rover, Your house thing, you are not comparing Apples to Apples. On an order the dealer cannot really sell the truck until it hits the lot. No one is coming by and passing on it cause it is not at the dealer for sale. If the guy passes on the order, when to truck comes in they will be able to sell it to the next guy.

Now if they stated NON REFUNDABLE up front on his deal and he knew that going in. The stand up thing to do would be to honor that.

I still don't get an answer about the house thing?
hmmmmm...what's up with that?

I feel the dealer probably got some calls from another prospective buyer, and told them "yep we have 5 allocated, but they are all spoken for", the caller then hung up and called another dealer and another and so on.

He certainly could have potentially sold (reserved) that one to someone else, but he held it for the person with the deposit down. 20 of our initial allocation of 25 were pre-sold at MSRP. Sounds like they're sold to me, even though they are "not on the lot".

When the person drops out, and doesn't buy from the dealer where he had the deposit, it screws up the ability of the dealer to offer it to someone else.

Then he has to try to re-contact all the people who wanted that particular option configuration, and they have moved on!

If I put money down to have a seller "hold" something for me, I have enough respect for them to ultimately buy it or expect them to keep my money if I don't.

So what about the house, apples or kumquats, I'd like to know the answer.

Love Ya, Mean it!

 

rover,
what is the purpose of a refundable deposit then?

i think these are just dealers who just are wishing that your pick will land in their laps, and then have you buy it.

i havent seen any kind of evidence of the dealer ordering my exact specs to be built in nippon.

 

My dealer told me that since this vehicle will be so sought after, they would return my downpayment if I did not like it. They even put that in writing. But I have not tested this promise yet and they DO appear to be total idiots.

 

rover,
what is the purpose of a refundable deposit then?

i think these are just dealers who just are wishing that your pick will land in their laps, and then have you buy it.

i havent seen any kind of evidence of the dealer ordering my exact specs to be built in nippon.

I don't advocate placing a refundable deposit on anything!

It's not really a deposit to reserve the vehicle. It is a way to take a buyer out of the market!

Just ask Riverside TROY?

He was stout on the brag about MSRP only, until the FJs came in and the BAM $3000 addendum!

He then just has to refund the deposit and profiteer away!

If I complete an earnest money agreement with a guest, we detail the exact options, the exact price, and an anticipated delivery date range and extimated mileage at delivery.....no surprises and no refunds.

Be a man, it's biznass!

Love Ya, Mean it!

 

y'no, despite my anti-dealer stance id have to partially agree with rover. however, it really is the understanding going into the agreement that carries the most weight. i told my dealer that if he can get me what i want in the time that i want it i will buy it from him. now that to him should be motivation to work for me as i have given my word. however, if i say ill put my deposit down, but continue looking elsewhere, there's really no motivation for him to work for me and get me what i want. by law if the deposit is refundable, then it is refundable. to me it really it's really a commentary on your business ethics. we complain a lot when dealers screw us. if dealerships start offering 4x4 with just CQ n stuff - ill ask my dealer if he can swap my order for something they already have on the lot. at the least im dealing with one of the larger toyoships in the bay area. anyway, it gets down to keeping your word and keeping your standards. in the end i dont really care - because a fair amount of these 'people' called salesmen deserve to be screwed in their rotting colons.

 

I don't advocate placing a refundable deposit on anything!

It's not really a deposit to reserve the vehicle. It is a way to take a buyer out of the market!

Just ask Riverside TROY?

He was stout on the brag about MSRP only, until the FJs came in and the BAM $3000 addendum!

He then just has to refund the deposit and profiteer away!

If I complete an earnest money agreement with a guest, we detail the exact options, the exact price, and an anticipated delivery date range and extimated mileage at delivery.....no surprises and no refunds.

Be a man, it's biznass!

Love Ya, Mean it!

NOBODY around here will do that brutha. that's what i want to do, put down a non-refundable deposit, towards my truck, options, accessories, fees, all that **** worked out ahead of time. but nooooooooooooooobody is willing to do that. so in this case, bizASS is just dealing with what they're dealing with. it's annoying as hell, but i want me one of dems trucks.

 

NOBODY around here will do that brutha. that's what i want to do, put down a non-refundable deposit, towards my truck, options, accessories, fees, all that **** worked out ahead of time. but nooooooooooooooobody is willing to do that. so in this case, bizASS is just dealing with what they're dealing with. it's annoying as hell, but i want me one of dems trucks.

I feel ya man! If I ruled the world, I would be removing some names from a few franchises.

I attended Toyota Financial Services training in Torrance and I met some really "thuggy" finance managers from SoCal. "Toyota Quality Financial Management" advocates up front pricing on all products offered and Longo is about the only one there that even comes close!

I am unfortunatley judged on the actions of my (illegitimate) brothers everyday. It's one of the toughest challenges I face in this business.

I offered a 2006 Camry last month-end to an older lady at $600 under invoice and showed her the invoice (upfront) and she "vapor-locked" on me and wanted to "shop around". She just knew there was a catch somewhere!

There was no catch, and she described it as the best car buying experience she had ever had! (after it was over)

 

I don't advocate placing a refundable deposit on anything!

It's not really a deposit to reserve the vehicle. It is a way to take a buyer out of the market!

Just ask Riverside TROY?

He was stout on the brag about MSRP only, until the FJs came in and the BAM $3000 addendum!

He then just has to refund the deposit and profiteer away!

If I complete an earnest money agreement with a guest, we detail the exact options, the exact price, and an anticipated delivery date range and extimated mileage at delivery.....no surprises and no refunds.

Be a man, it's biznass!

Love Ya, Mean it!

this is what i thought! this makes sense.
thanks.

p.s.
regarding being a man, its the dealers that have the job to clarify exactly what their intentions are. from my perspective,im under the impression that the sales'men' are doing their job,, not just trying to trick me into waiting for my truck to fall in their lap..

 

Unfortunately, the order transaction is never black and white. The dealer only gets so many that they “earn”. You order one, but it’s not one that they are getting in their allocation. Now the fun begins. How hard is the dealer willing to work for you ? Is he willing to swap one that he earns to get you the one you want or sell it to another customer and let you wait till they earn more ? You never know what is going on behind the scenes…but now you keep getting “we haven’t found yours yet” after each allocation cycle (2X per month). This can go on for weeks/months. So is it unfair to request your deposit back after some period of time ?

 

Unfortunately, the order transaction is never black and white. The dealer only gets so many that they “earn”. You order one, but it’s not one that they are getting in their allocation. Now the fun begins. How hard is the dealer willing to work for you ? Is he willing to swap one that he earns to get you the one you want or sell it to another customer and let you wait till they earn more ? You never know what is going on behind the scenes…but now you keep getting “we haven’t found yours yet” after each allocation cycle (2X per month). This can go on for weeks/months. So is it unfair to request your deposit back after some period of time ?

short answer is no. if the dealer is exceeding the expected time of delivery in my mind they are d1cking with you and basically breaking their word to you. excuses break contracts as far as im concerned. lack of communication breaks contracts. so on and so forth. so long as the dealer is being straight (as far as you can tell), providing you real information and not just word of mouth than i would stay the course. however if the insurgency has penetrated the dealers a$$hole, then i would cut and run.

 

short answer is no. if the dealer is exceeding the expected time of delivery in my mind they are d1cking with you and basically breaking their word to you. excuses break contracts as far as im concerned. lack of communication breaks contracts. so on and so forth. so long as the dealer is being straight (as far as you can tell), providing you real information and not just word of mouth than i would stay the course. however if the insurgency has penetrated the dealers a$$hole, then i would cut and run.

Damm.....caliFJ the voice of reason???? So he new meds are working for you thats good I agree totally If I drop a deposit and they say we can have it in xx amount of time and it doesn't happen than see ya!! to many dealers out there to get ****ed around ! I would of course have everyone agree to that going in...

 

the reason for a deposit is so we are guaranteed to hear back for you. Ask yourself this.. how many times have you told a dealer that you would be back later in the day with no intentions of following through? I don't fault you for it, as it allows you to have an easier exit. I do the same thing to salespeople..

As far as refundable vs. nonrefundable. That is entirely up to your state's laws. In Illinois, you can sign all the paperwork, drive it around the lot for 100 miles. The vehicle is not considered sold until you drive off the lot and hit public property. Given that fact, it is illegal in IL to have a non-refundable deposit. As a matter of fact, we don't even take deposits on used cars for the reasons mentioned above. I hold the car, you tell me NO 2 days later, and I lost out on a few pontential deals. Now I have to scramble to call all those people back. It just isn't worth it. If you like the car, buy the car. Or you take the risk.

The FJ is hot enough. We can sell every one we get in. I don't know a single dealer that would rather keep your $500 and have all the bad press you will be spreading around than just refund the money, sell it to another customer, and make more on the sale.

Any reputable dealer will give you back your deposit. I used to tell the customers that they will get their money back when the vehicle ultimately sells. That is perfectly legal. However, I would only do that if it truly was some oddball combination.. Purple with orange seats or something.

 

I don't advocate placing a refundable deposit on anything!

It's not really a deposit to reserve the vehicle. It is a way to take a buyer out of the market!

Just ask Riverside TROY?

He was stout on the brag about MSRP only, until the FJs came in and the BAM $3000 addendum!

He then just has to refund the deposit and profiteer away!

If I complete an earnest money agreement with a guest, we detail the exact options, the exact price, and an anticipated delivery date range and extimated mileage at delivery.....no surprises and no refunds.

Be a man, it's biznass!

Love Ya, Mean it!

Pricless

 

Us sales guys are trained in that kind of lingo.

Used Cars = Pre-Owned Vehicles
Cigarette lighters = Cigar Lighters (in more affluent vehicles) = power ports
Certified Cars = Vehicles with extended warranties already built into the price.

 

My understanding is in California, the law requires them to refund your money, not sure is there are loopholes or contracts that go around this law... but I have heard that the DMV can help if the Dealer refuses your refund in the State of CA.

Hope this helps!