King.

 

Thanks for the opinion =).

I just ordered the Fox 2.5" coilovers for the front and the 2.0" piggybacks with the 8-Way adjustment. Obviously, I went with Fox, so that would be my suggestion. I went with them because my grandpa runs them on his jeep, 3 trucks, and 2 long travel sand cars. They are great on all of our vehicles. I chose them based on their reputation, customer service, and performance. :bigthumb: Haven't gotten mine installed yet, still waiting for them to arrive from All-Pro. But I will let you know how they are when I do get them installed. :cheers:

How long does it usually take for all pro to send them?

Thanks for the opinion btw.

$1000 more for the kings? Unless you are getting their race shocks that seems quite steep to me compared to the foxes. Their performance series is the normal OEM ones from my understanding, not their race series.

Imo if you valve them similarly and run the same rate coil you are not going to notice any difference between them. Pretty sure both are a progressive shock as well.

A common statement is "pick a color". If you aren't happy with the performance change the valving or spring rate.

Yup it's the OEM series, and around a $1000 difference between the fox extended and the king oem. I'm quite confused with what I would get, would the 2.5" rears make a big difference in travel numbers too?

 

I just ordered the Fox 2.5" coilovers for the front and the 2.0" piggybacks with the 8-Way adjustment. Obviously, I went with Fox, so that would be my suggestion. I went with them because my grandpa runs them on his jeep, 3 trucks, and 2 long travel sand cars. They are great on all of our vehicles. I chose them based on their reputation, customer service, and performance. :bigthumb: Haven't gotten mine installed yet, still waiting for them to arrive from All-Pro. But I will let you know how they are when I do get them installed. :cheers:

 

$1000 more for the kings? Unless you are getting their race shocks that seems quite steep to me compared to the foxes. Their performance series is the normal OEM ones from my understanding, not their race series.

Imo if you valve them similarly and run the same rate coil you are not going to notice a significant difference between them. Pretty sure both are a progressive shock as well, so not much difference there.

A common statement is "pick a color" (blue - king, black - icon/fox, red - SAW, etc). If you aren't happy with the performance change the valving or spring rate.

EDIT: didn't see you mention the rear shocks too when I first read it. If you are noticing shock fade in the rear with your current setup a 2.5" shock wouldn't hurt. Also guessing that accounts for some of the cost difference.

 

jI just shopped for the same shocks recently;Kings, Fox, Walker Evans, Radflo, and SAW, and bought Walker Evans.

You would love either option Im sure.

Here in the US, the Kings front remote resi coilovers are only a couple hundred dollars more than tge equivalent Foxes from All Pro,($1450 vs $1300)and I see no reason the installation is any different. I'd go Fox unless you must have blue Kings!

I'll admit if money was no matter, I would have bought Foxes or Kings. However I trust the WEs will perform as well, they just don't have the name recognition or color I would have first chosen but they look great and are ready for install.

 

Money is no issue for me, as long as I get the best travel numbers and performance off-road + on-road,

thanks for the opinion and looking to hear from some more of the LT beasts =).

 

Well recently Fox has been behind on their orders, All-Pro told me 6 weeks. I don't know if that's when All-Pro will get them or if that's when they will be on my doorstep. I will have to e-mail them again.

 

That's nice, any pick a color or other options you were able to get?

 

G'day,
King's for me... they are Blue .... haha
But i'm only running OE's
Cheers
Baz

 

Haha, thank you for the opinion =).

No reason for the kings to cost that much more. I run Kings now but have had the fox and they are a fine product. I doubt you could find a better company to work with than king. They have fantastic reps. BTW more off road events have been won on kings than any other shock.........

Good, so you tried them both and fox is still a "fine" product. I know, the distributor here is a very nice guy, free revalving after a year, lots of stickers, free bushings replacements, reservoir pipes, clamps, etc. etc. for a year too.

I wouldn't go with "more off road events have been won on kings", Foxes are nearly never seen, I suggest you do some more SCORE watching and see the fox/camburg trophy truck, now that's a beauty.

I have the OEM kings with reservoirs and camburg UCA and they ride awesome I have no complaints. I chose kings mainly because if their reputation , looking at all the multi million dollar trophy trucks and sand rails using them tells me that they must know something. And lets face it that is a sweet looking blue!!


Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app

Thank you for sharing your opinion, again read my above comment on what SandFJ has said.

The ones on All-Pros website are blue. The picture on their website is black but if you add it to your cart and then click on it from inside your cart, it will show the actual blue color. The black ones are long travel and only work with their LT kit. It's not as bright as King's blue, but it's still blue. And the spring on it is a 600 lb/in and are adjustable up to a 3.5" lift. When you order from All-Pro, you would get 10% off any other front suspension components you order such as UCA's. :bigthumb:

Oh I see, I think they look like the ones that were on Todd's FJ (Air2air).

600lb sounds just fine for my ride or for any other pre-runner to be ride, 3.5" lift always loved a nose-up look. Thank you again for the details, cheers buddy!

I'd go with a long travel kit if your into jumping.

That was my route except I got told that such kits won't be allowed for a car to be registered on an annual basis because of the "welding" and because of a few laws, unless I go with the routine off taking off the LT and then registering the car and then putting it back in which would be annoying.

I'd be quite interested to see where you got this. FOX has been around a lot longer than king (25 plus years), so I find this quite hard to believe. Got a reference?

You can look at fox's website and see how many folks they had on the podium last year. Regardless, I don't see how that makes it clear by any means that one shock is better than the other, alot more goes into a race than just 4/8 shocks.




I'll play devils advocate. I'd recommend looking at a few more trophy trucks as FOX has dominated the overall points in SCORE for a number of years. Many of the TT and shortcourse folks run Fox shocks (Robbie Mac, Johnny Greaves, McMillin, Campbell, etc.).

Again that being said, it wouldn't be the reason I would go out and buy a Fox shock.


My post isn't to knock King or Fox or to promote King or Fox.

The reason you see a lot of King Shocks in desert racing is because they have strong support and customer service. They are out at most of the large events and do tuning for folks. Definitely impressive and I've heard good things about their customer service :bigthumb:

Fox is out at fewer events and generally sponsors/is on the big names/vehicles within the industry. Last short course race I went to Fox was there with their trailer, but not a single fox representative around. All that being said I'm aware of Foxes background and they've been an industry leader for quite some time. In the early days billstein and other mfgs were highering away many of the Fox engineers since they were leaders in offroad shock development and could transition that to onroad and track applications as well (basically ground breaking stuff for the track cars).

Either one makes a fine product.

Back to my original point if the shocks are valved similarly and running the same rate coils you'd have a hard time telling the difference. That's why folks tend to say "pick a color". The only added value I potentially see by spending more for the kings is the 2.5"body shock on the rear which may be of benefit to you. It doesn't buy you more travel, but would be of use if you are overheating your shocks. You should be able to setup either coilover for the same amount of travel, by working with the mfg or rebuilding it yourself.

In my opinion, your money is best spent tuning the suspension, getting the right coil and valve stack, than trying to pick between shock mfgs. You aren't building a race truck here and either one will be reliable for your application.


Toss ICON, Radflo, SAW, and ADS into the mix as well. Slight differences in manufacturing and valving philosphy, but pretty similar across the board when it comes to our applications. I personally like FOXKINGICONRADFLOSAWADS shocks...work better than anything out there :bigthumb:

Couldn't agree more =).

Crap I forgot bilstein in my favorite shock name title. Toss them in too!

In regards to tuning it either comes down to your capabilities, the local shops, or the mfgs. Being in the UAE you might want to give the customer service aspect some strong consideration. Several of those mfgs mentioned above are more adept at dealing with the little guys rather than only providing customer service major corporations or race teams.

Good luck with your decision. Out of curiousity are there any UAE legal requirements which prevent you from modifying the suspension with or front and rear design?

Well yes I did answer that above. That was my route except I got told that such kits won't be allowed for a car to be registered on an annual basis because of the "welding" and because of a few laws, unless I go with the routine off taking off the LT and then registering the car and then putting it back in which would be annoying.

You really need to go with a long travel setup for the type of offroading you do. With a stock configuration (travel) you really won't notice a difference between the top manufacturers. The travel on them will be very close to the same. In the rear the shocks are not really what limits your travel. The control arms, bump stops, and panhard bar all play a roll in the travel.

You are right and read my above comment for FJNewB.

You can always go with the All Pro LT kit for about $8000 with all the bells and whistles like Old Cruiser has on his FJ. They can combine LT Fox Shocks. You'll need extended axles to retain the 4wd...

Yup, read my comment for FJNewB.

All I can add is that the Fox 2.5" extended w/resivoir and 2.0" piggy back system has turned my rig into a twisty highway, dessert road, sand dune and rocky trail "Mashing machine!

That sounds great, thank you for your opinion!

LT in the dunes for the win!

A lot more to debate than Fox vs King for the dunes.

Haha true that.

From what i've read when it comes to lifts, I'd say King is better and well worth the money.

Opinion appreciated even a little bit of what you experienced with either of the shocks would be great to defend your point too.

Can you elaborate on what led you to that conclusion? I'm sure that many would enjoy the reading you are refering to to educate themselves as well :bigthumb:

:clap:

Referring.

Here's a side by side, though I don't know that a conclusive decision could be drawn, unless wise to the ways to material properties and hydraulics.

Fox Vs. King

Had a look at that and that's impressive, they chopped them down to bits and pieces and explained everything that both companies use for their shocks. :rocker:

...probably a lot of what's in this forum. I enjoy reading yours and DeLancy's posts/threads. They are very informative and you guys seem to know what you're talking about, very technical, interesting and HELPFUL. I gotta say, though, I notice you ask people to list their references quite often. It may dissuade others from posting their advice/input (which is what the OP is asking for). I guess I agree with FJX200 because, hey, I got the KINGs so I must've compiled enough information to make that choice somewhere. I can't remember or have the inclination to research and list EVERY SINGLE PIECE of literature I've read that has led me to a certain conclusion and I don't believe other forum members want to. I don't post much because I don't know ish and so I ask a lot of questions. I think at this point we all know we are not nearly as knowledgeable as yourself and a few others when it comes to our toys and look to you guys for advice. NO sarcasm there, that's from the heart. Anyway, see you out on a trail some time. Peace! :bigthumb:

:X

It's Delancy. Just saying. Haha.

I've no experience with Fox, but do with King.

Awesome ride quality and construction quality was top notch, in comparison to many other brands I've installed or visually seen. The resi's are large, coil retainers are properly sized. Lower shock eye is the largest I know of (an assumption that translates into strength) the upper bushings on the rear shocks are tougher, and the retainers are machined, not oversized washers.

Plus the coil nut is the easiest of any to adjust inside the confines of the FJC coil bucket.

Great product, but their customer service doesn't parallel, and the reason for the swap to Radflo's, whose customer service is the best in the business. Period.

Plus, blue is for Baz's Bozo.

Edit: I've swapped the rear bushings and clear aluminum bushing retainers from what Glenn sent, to the King's some time ago.

Another advantage King has, pertinent to the particular set up I have, is the bump can mounting method for air bumps. A lot cleaner, in my opinion.

Thank you Chris (was it?) for sharing your opinion too!

Well, it's a hard debate and don't really know what I'm going for but I'm gonna ask the guy to look me up into some race series shocks, if they're worth it then I'll go for 'em otherwise if the ones he have are the OEM then no-no kings, hooray for fox.

 

No reason for the kings to cost that much more. I run Kings now but have had the fox and they are a fine product. I doubt you could find a better company to work with than king. They have fantastic reps. BTW more off road events have been won on kings than any other shock.........

 

BTW more off road events have been won on kings than any other shock.........

I'd be quite interested to see where you got this. FOX has been around a lot longer than king (25 plus years), so I find this quite hard to believe. Got a reference?

You can look at fox's website and see how many folks they had on the podium last year. Regardless, I don't see how that makes it clear by any means that one shock is better than the other, alot more goes into a race than just 4/8 shocks.

I have the OEM kings with reservoirs and camburg UCA and they ride awesome I have no complaints. I chose kings mainly because if their reputation , looking at all the multi million dollar trophy trucks and sand rails using them tells me that they must know something. And lets face it that is a sweet looking blue!!
Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app

I'll play devils advocate. I'd recommend looking at a few more trophy trucks as FOX has dominated the overall points in SCORE for a number of years. Many of the TT and shortcourse folks run Fox shocks (Robbie Mac, Johnny Greaves, McMillin, Campbell, etc.).

Again that being said, it wouldn't be the reason I would go out and buy a Fox shock.


My post isn't to knock King or Fox or to promote King or Fox.

The reason you see a lot of King Shocks in desert racing is because they have strong support and customer service. They are out at most of the large events and do tuning for folks. Definitely impressive and I've heard good things about their customer service :bigthumb:

Fox is out at fewer events and generally sponsors/is on the big names/vehicles within the industry. Last short course race I went to Fox was there with their trailer, but not a single fox representative around. All that being said I'm aware of Foxes background and they've been an industry leader for quite some time. In the early days billstein and other mfgs were highering away many of the Fox engineers since they were leaders in offroad shock development and could transition that to onroad and track applications as well (basically ground breaking stuff for the track cars).

Either one makes a fine product.

Back to my original point if the shocks are valved similarly and running the same rate coils you'd have a hard time telling the difference. That's why folks tend to say "pick a color". The only added value I potentially see by spending more for the kings is the 2.5"body shock on the rear which may be of benefit to you. It doesn't buy you more travel, but would be of use if you are overheating your shocks. You should be able to setup either coilover for the same amount of travel, by working with the mfg or rebuilding it yourself.

In my opinion, your money is best spent tuning the suspension, getting the right coil and valve stack, than trying to pick between shock mfgs. You aren't building a race truck here and either one will be reliable for your application.


Toss ICON, Radflo, SAW, and ADS into the mix as well. Slight differences in manufacturing and valving philosphy, but pretty similar across the board when it comes to our applications. I personally like FOXKINGICONRADFLOSAWADS shocks...work better than anything out there :bigthumb:

 

I have the OEM kings with reservoirs and camburg UCA and they ride awesome I have no complaints. I chose kings mainly because if their reputation , looking at all the multi million dollar trophy trucks and sand rails using them tells me that they must know something. And lets face it that is a sweet looking blue!!


Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app

 

Finally going to order mine today....Woo Hoo:clap:
After a couple years reading threads..bummer...:crying

 

I'd go with a long travel kit if your into jumping.

 

Crap I forgot bilstein in my favorite shock name title. Toss them in too!

In regards to tuning it either comes down to your capabilities, the local shops, or the mfgs. Being in the UAE you might want to give the customer service aspect some strong consideration. Several of those mfgs mentioned above are more adept at dealing with the little guys rather than only providing customer service major corporations or race teams.

Good luck with your decision. Out of curiousity are there any UAE legal requirements which prevent you from modifying the suspension with or front and rear design?

 

You really need to go with a long travel setup for the type of offroading you do. With a stock configuration (travel) you really won't notice a difference between the top manufacturers. The travel on them will be very close to the same. In the rear the shocks are not really what limits your travel. The control arms, bump stops, and panhard bar all play a roll in the travel.

 

You can always go with the All Pro LT kit for about $8000 with all the bells and whistles like Old Cruiser has on his FJ. They can combine LT Fox Shocks. You'll need extended axles to retain the 4wd...

 

All I can add is that the Fox 2.5" extended w/resivoir and 2.0" piggy back system has turned my rig into a twisty highway, dessert road, sand dune and rocky trail "Mashing machine!

 

LT in the dunes for the win!

A lot more to debate than Fox vs King for the dunes.

 

From what i've read when it comes to lifts, I'd say King is better and well worth the money.

 

Can you elaborate on what led you to that conclusion? I'm sure that many would enjoy the reading you are refering to to educate themselves as well :bigthumb:

 

Referring.

Here's a side by side, though I don't know that a conclusive decision could be drawn, unless wise to the ways to material properties and hydraulics.

http://www.offroad-engineering.com/foxvsking.html

 

It's Delancy. Just saying. Haha.

I've no experience with Fox, but do with King.

Awesome ride quality and construction quality was top notch, in comparison to many other brands I've installed or visually seen. The resi's are large, coil retainers are properly sized. Lower shock eye is the largest I know of (an assumption that translates into strength) the upper bushings on the rear shocks are tougher, and the retainers are machined, not oversized washers.

Plus the coil nut is the easiest of any to adjust inside the confines of the FJC coil bucket.

Great product, but their customer service doesn't parallel, and the reason for the swap to Radflo's, whose customer service is the best in the business. Period.

Plus, blue is for Baz's Bozo.

Edit: I've swapped the rear bushings and clear aluminum bushing retainers from what Glenn sent, to the King's some time ago.

Another advantage King has, pertinent to the particular set up I have, is the bump can mounting method for air bumps. A lot cleaner, in my opinion.

 

Surprised Alex hasn't come yet, hope he's doing fine, I really love his posts, great guy, all hail Old Cruiser to reply, haha.

 

I think those prerunner shocks are the performance series. Seemed like most of the seals were PEEK or Buna. I know the race series uses viton for the higher temperatures.

 

See? That's what I'm talking about! You really know your stuff, FJNewb! I thought about my post shortly after I posted it. I thought: OF COURSE he's going to ask where people are getting their information. That's what has lead you to all of your own knowledge. I didn't think you MEANT to be offensive, I only considered the poster's probable reaction. Beers to ya, dude.

 

Oh I agree....having lived abroad I have felt your pain but I was referencing the difference between the two.....generally speaking when comparing apples to apples (oem to oem or race to race) there isnt a huge disparity in the two. kings are often a little more but not much.

Yes both products are indeed great.......your gonna love em. Good luck.

 

Mainly one of the reasons why I really wanna move to the states, eBay, Amazon, any other website is at your hands, shipping won't cost much, everything gets to you faster!

I agree with the apple story too :lol:

 

The ORE comparison is a few years old, and IMO has a slight bias in favor of the Fox damper, even if the author didn't intend it. Weather one realizes it or not, by simply comparing a new Fox unit to a used King piece, one looks quite a bit better than the other.

There are also many things pertaining to a shocks performance that are not touched on... and w/o knowing certain materials, we really can't make a good comparison, but I can get you thinking about it. An example is the 17-4 stainless shaft Fox uses, it sure sounds better to me, it's very corrosion resistant. However, the shaft of a shock does aid in the cooling of the oil through convection. Stainless steel is roughly 300% (yes 300) less efficient at transferring heat over many plain steels. So will this show an operating temperature difference? Both are chrome plated. Another point about the shaft... the diameter of the shaft where the piston is secured/mounts. The King is much larger here... this will aid in the ability to withstand topping the shock out. Ever wonder why many folks strap their suspension? BUT, we really need to know the material, along with machining and surface finish practices. These are very real differences, and they are not mentioned.

King has trickled down some of the Race series upgrades to the Prerunner. The piston is now anodized and uses an O ring to back and lightly load the wearband. This creates a situation where not only is more of the oil is forced to be metered by the valving, but this performance will last longer as the o ring keeps the wearband pressed against the the tube wall and fills the space between it and the piston.

I can go on... but for me, when it comes down to the end of the day, King will still build me whatever I, or my customer, wants.

 

I can't imagine there's bias in any comparison article in an off road publication. Haha.

Very early in my suspension education, at the expense of various retailers, the resounding reply when posing a question similar to the OT was "King" from those that carry various brands, and for a variety of reasons.

Edited: That said, I'll be working with Glenn at Radflo on the 80, until the point in time comes that hell freezes over and his customer service skills diminish.

 

Plus I saw something in their brochure and got amazed by it, might even go for Kings because of what I saw, something like this:

Gold plated, 24 karat gold or something it said, dunno what the hell is that but it sure looks so amazing to me, had the guy ask me how much they're gonna cost me if I'm gonna go for 4 haha.[/QUOTE]

G'day,
But they are not Blue ...... hahaha
Cheers
Baz
:cheers:

 

Plus I saw something in their brochure and got amazed by it, might even go for Kings because of what I saw, something like this:

Gold plated, 24 karat gold or something it said, dunno what the hell is that but it sure looks so amazing to me, had the guy ask me how much they're gonna cost me if I'm gonna go for 4 haha.

G'day,
But they are not Blue ...... hahaha
Cheers
Baz
:cheers:[/QUOTE]

Hahaha! Kings are known for their unique blue color.

Thats Big Pimpin stuff there!!!

:lol:

Haha Alex! on the verge of getting some 22" spinners too! :lol:

 

Thats Big Pimpin stuff there!!!

:lol:

 

Hey Yamaji

Really interesting thread. I realized it hasn't been updated in 3 weeks so I am assuming you didn't pull the triger as of yet on your suspensions of choice!

I am in the market for front and rear systems and it seems like OC got us both set with our prefrences - Thanks for all your help OC :bigthumb:

I will be visiting Dubai next week, and I am planing to buy the suspentions while I am there given that the dealers offer me a good (reasonable) price. Otherwise, my friend is currently visiting the US and he'll be back to Qatar within 10 days - he'd be happy to hook us both up with whatever you are in the market for and sort out the shipping (he is in OH).

I am slightly concerned about fitting King's coilovers (the reservoir tube to be spcefic) within the UCA's and I don't trust/expect the local shops to know how to handle this - I believe others faced a lot of issues with this!!
So I may be very well taking OC's direct advice to go for Fox in the front with King's rear shocks and aftermarket springs (I will also aim to have the nose leveled slightly higher).


Thoughts are highly appreciated

:cheers:

 

Hey Khaled,

If you read the first post it states that I already ordered my Fox shox and I'm waiting for them to reach me, they'll take a while (pfffft). But, I was trying to compare and contrast to whether to keep and install the foxes or just sell them to a guy I know that wants them and go for kings, in the end it's all the same but I'm more into Fox so that's the way for me plus I don't trust the guys here at all, they don't know what they're doing, they're telling me install kings because of their name "KING", their reputation, they're not even comparing about how they're tuned, what's their performance, etc. etc. it's all about names in here, whatever people go for other people will do so too that's why I stick with making my car as unique as possible and install/do stuff that nearly no one has ever done on an FJ =).

I sincerely thank OC because he has helped me with nearly every bolt that has been installed on my project, he's a great guy and deserves all of my respect to him, SALUTE ALEX :rocker:. I'm working on another project for winter (keeping it a secret) but the way my car rides now is really really good, the foxes are just a "bling" upgrade I think. I'm riding on toytecs in the front and icons in the rear, custom tunes here and there and she rides awesome now.